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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:21 pm 
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Location: Markham, ON, CA
anatech wrote:
Hi Tom, others,
Please remember that I also said that you must clean the WD-40 out with a non-residue cleaner. Every single non-residue cleaner I've had the pleasure to play with has ignited beautifully. Explosively in fact.

Any relay contact or connector you clean with WD-40 will not have any future damage due to an acid as long as you clean the WD-40 out / off. Notice also that I was careful to mention that critical contacts are only cleaned with IPA, that's all.

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Why not use a good contact cleaner/lubricant instead? There are a ton of them out there and you will not have any worries about sulfur.

Any lubricant or almost any coating left on relay contacts or power handling switches will burn and promote the destruction of those contacts. You must not leave anything on those contacts!

I have tried almost every contact cleaner and lubricant for contacts out there over my 40 + years. I'm still looking for something that is effective. Hitting the contacts with WD-40 followed by a no-residue cleaner is the best answer I have found thus far. Believe me, I am open to suggestions.

Oh yeah, remember that the sulphur content is less than 500 ppm in WD-40. You're not going to see a lot of corrosion unless you have a lot of WD-40 in there.

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then coat with Krown rust-preventative.

How do you keep that stuff from burning between the contact surfaces?

Please PM me with the cleaner you have found to be effective. I'll try it right away, and if it is effective I will happily start using it.

-Chris



By the way, sorry for the massive thread drift!!

Chris, I'll PM you with the details. And I agree that, in exposed areas where WD-40 has been flushed with brake clean or other cleansers, the risk of corrosion is minimized. In areas in automotive/aircraft looms where contacts are encased in housings, WD-40 is awful. It cannot be flushed out, it attracts water as soon as the volatiles flash off, and rots connections/wires.

Krown is a fish oil. Used as an automotive and industrial water displacer and rust preventative. It has a high film strength, takes a long time to evaporate, and (at least in 12-24 volt use) seems impervious to electrical breakdown. I spray it on contact switches (like window switches) window and antenna motors and have never had an electrical failure. We use it as a local water displacer on electrical sockets, plug connections (such as automotive switches, relays, sensors. It has yet to cause a customer to return with the same complaint. And it smells quite acceptable....pleasant, in fact.

I'll grab the can of contact spray and call you with the label info.

Again, sorry for the thread drift......
Tom


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:39 pm 
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Here is the contact cleaner we use. FAA approved. LPS manufacture a number of cleaner / lubricants. Their stuff works well. At least for our applications. Take a look around in the catalogue;
https://www.aircraftspruce.ca/catalog/c ... key=284054


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 2:52 pm 
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Hi Tom,
Thank you for that.

-Chris


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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 4:48 pm 
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WD-40 was originally whale oil. Best ever. Except for the whole whale thing....

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PostPosted: Tue Mar 06, 2018 6:32 pm 
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You would think that the oil would go rancid after a while, wouldn't it? These days it is a petroleum product for the most part.

-Chris


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 4:27 pm 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Just got updated from Charisma Audio. tech run the amp for hours and hours testing 2 channels at the time at listening level and there is nothing wrong with the amp. tech also tested at letting the amp cool down in cold temp but he did not detects any contact issue. he does not think it is the relay problem.

for the distortion issue i have. he did not detect any of that when he tested with playing music for hours. he thinks if something is wrong with the amp is either the transistors or the capacitors.tech said that this is timing consuming if he opened up piece by piece to test.

can any of you could pin point the problem?


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:13 pm 
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Hi outfire,
Without the amplifier on my bench in front of me, nailing the exact cause would involve a crystal ball and mystical powers.

Quote:
he thinks if something is wrong with the amp is either the transistors or the capacitors.tech said that this is timing consuming if he opened up piece by piece to test.

That statement doesn't even make sense. Question. Did they just listen to music or did they put it on a very sensitive distortion analyser? I don't know Charisma Audio and haven't got a clue as to whether they have a technician who knows what he/she is doing, or even if they have the needed test equipment. Test equipment is very expensive to obtain and maintain. One reason I sold my shop. The money just wasn't there to support a proper service centre.

Ask them what kind of distortion analyser they have and report back. The reason is that I recently had a preamp come in with a complaint of distortion on one channel. It sounded fine, but once I got it connected to my equipment I quickly found out that the customer was right. This particular failure was a dead transistor (open actually). Once repaired, the distortion numbers fell right in line with what was normal for it. If I had just listened to music, I might have sent it back no fault found.

If this is a store, they may just farm the repairs out to an external technician or repair shop. That would explain such an odd response from them.

-Chris


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 6:46 pm 
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just got a replied "From what I know, other than listening, he did some measurements as well."

thanks for your time Chris.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:03 pm 
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Hi outfire,
No problem.

From that response, my guess would be that they didn't have any equipment of note. In other words, nothing of recent or high quality in the way of a distortion analyser.

I would accept the N.F.F. diagnoses and get thee to a really good technician. Someone with good quality test equipment at the very least. An FFT type instrument would be preferred, or a real spectrum analyser. FFT stands for "Fast Fourier Transform". It looks at a signal and displays all the frequency components. So for a 1 KHz input, you will have varying amounts of 2,3,4,5 KHz components (and so on). Distortion will radically increase the levels of the harmonics. A good THD analyser (HP 339A for example) will give you the total of all harmonics and noise in the signal.

I used an HP 339A for years and sent the "residuals" to an oscilloscope or a spectrum analyser. It was a good combination. Recently I picked up a brand new device that is close to being an Audio Precision analyser. It wasn't cheap and really extends my measurement ability. It isn't a sound card either. Even the software to run these things is pricey.

Find a shop or tech that invests in new (to them at least) equipment. They will be able to give you definitive answers. You may have to travel to find someone who can truly help you. Remember, you need to find the actual shop or technician that does the work, and they shouldn't be afraid to show you their mess (code for bench). I'm way out in Georgetown so I'm not trying to have you come to me. Just find a good tech. You might want to seriously consider seeing Rick at Ontario Audio. He's closer in Brampton.

Best, Chris


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:14 pm 
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Nakamichel wrote:
This sounds like a cold joint solder somewhere.
It needs servicing. Better to not use it until then.
Unless there's a problem with your connection to your amplifier somewhere
it really sounds like I said in my first reply. Solder problem. It's easy to find out with the right equipments as Chris told you.
Sound cutting issue whether is in a device or is a cold solder will leave trace by making very very small noise visible on a scope or spectrum analyzer.

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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:22 pm 
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do you open on the weekend chris?


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:32 pm 
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Hi outfire,
Yes, but I'm far away from you. I'm in Georgetown very close to Highway #7 (Guelph St.) and Trafalgar Road.

If you really want to come this far, PM me and I'll give you my exact address and email.

Are you sure it isn't an RCA cable or something like that? Check by hooking it back up, and while playing move the wires around slowly. See if it cuts out. That might save you a trip out here.

-Chris


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 7:46 pm 
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Hi Chris,

i dont know if it is the rca cables issue but i am using the same rca cable through the marantz sr5005 with the parasound hca750a. there are no distortion, nothing is cutting out, no loud gain when i turn up or down the volume slowly on the preamp.

i will test the rca cable again when i get the amp back. an hour is far but i have driven from toronto to calgary alot when i used to live in calgary. i will shoot you a pm.


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PostPosted: Wed Mar 07, 2018 8:03 pm 
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Hi outfire,
Sounds good. I was just hoping it was something simple like that.

-Chris


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 08, 2018 6:26 am 
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But guys, do not forget us.
We want to know everything :mrgreen:

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