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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:34 pm 
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Itsnotluck wrote:
James_W wrote:
I wouldn't be making any long term system or media decisions from a visit to an audio store. Newbie mistake. Explore the subject a bit more before committing to a point of view, good or bad.



You could probably still learn something from an audio store James...That was my first chance to compare a music service (Tidal) compared to ripped Flac files..Through the same server I could pick out the difference quite easily..


I think what James is saying is don't swallow the hook the first time you swim by it. Research the topic. He has the experience to know. I agree wholeheartedly.

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 7:52 pm 
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armypety wrote:
Stop dealing with Advance they are old school. They are all about profit margins and they don't do internet sales what does that tell you, enough said.

I get the internet sales position, though not sure how much longer they can avoid it. I have long dealt with Advance and they have been very good to me. In fact I brought home a Bryston pre amp from them today to trial here and taking it back tomorrow.
I have never found streaming from an internet service or radio to be as engaging as local sourced. I do prefer ripped files over cd, though I have never been a cd person and have never put much into a cd player. I do have a set up that is primarily for internet streaming and am quite pleased with the presentation through it, but it is not the level of my basement set up where analogue sources are primary.
Gerhard - the offer still stands to bring over your Special 40's to connect to my Sudgen. I can show you what i have set up with streaming and maybe give you a different perspective on it.


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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:31 pm 
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mpublicover wrote:
armypety wrote:
Stop dealing with Advance they are old school. They are all about profit margins and they don't do internet sales what does that tell you, enough said.

I get the internet sales position, though not sure how much longer they can avoid it. I have long dealt with Advance and they have been very good to me. In fact I brought home a Bryston pre amp from them today to trial here and taking it back tomorrow.
I have never found streaming from an internet service or radio to be as engaging as local sourced. I do prefer ripped files over cd, though I have never been a cd person and have never put much into a cd player. I do have a set up that is primarily for internet streaming and am quite pleased with the presentation through it, but it is not the level of my basement set up where analogue sources are primary.
Gerhard - the offer still stands to bring over your Special 40's to connect to my Sudgen. I can show you what i have set up with streaming and maybe give you a different perspective on it.
And you both need to hear the Sugden/Special 40 combo!!! :)

Sublime....

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PostPosted: Sun Jul 08, 2018 8:50 pm 
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Itsnotluck wrote:
David_big_ears wrote:
Hi Gerhard:

Streaming is really easy:

Basically, you plug the DAC into your laptop via the USB port, and plug your amp into the DAC. Then you go to the Deezer.com website, and start playing music.

David


Ok I must be doing something wrong because I can not successfully go from my Mac Lap top straight to my Dac with my Deezer desktop app...Actually I just finished reading that you can't but you can go direct to from Lap top to Dac with a tidal subscription...For the moment I stream Deezer through sonos to dac but really would like to bypass the Sonos and hope for better SQ....

For the record Deezer streamed in to Dac can't beat my CD spinner or my vinyl....


Yikes. I guess I have to add the caveat that I'm a PC guy. I don't get Apple stuff at all. I'm not sure what a "Deezer desktop app" is. I just open a Chrome browser, and visit the Deezer.com website. Boom. Music plays. I can plug headphones into my Windows-based laptop or use USB to plug the laptop into my DAC. Don't Apple product use USB? If your DAC has USB input, it should just recognize the laptop, no? I thought that's what using USB was about. Sorry. Apple stuff always seems to have a different set of problems than PC, and historically, I've never been able to help anybody with Apple gear.

I tried Tidal at one point, but went back to Deezer. In terms of Sonos... I can't really comment. I don't own one. I stream Deezer via bluetooth to my bluetooth enabled-devices such as my Olive One and my car stereo. It works great. The one problem is that my daughter will sometimes hijack the the music by starting a new stream from her Android phone running Deezer. One minute it's bluegrass and jazz, then next it's hiphop and other noise.

In terms of SQ, there is a difference in SQ between the free and paid versions of Deezer. You get better sound for your $10/month. I have a friend who is far more discerning that I am (and his CD player costs more than my entire rig). He's happy with the paid version of Deezer. I still use the free version, but frankly with just a Dragonfly DAC, it's not really worth the money. I will confess my CD player with its tubes does sound better than the Dragonfly. But here's the thing. I only have a couple of hundred CDs. I'm bored. Deezer gives me all the CDs.

For me, having instant access to thousands of albums in dozens of genres I had never heard before beats the SQ issue. To be clear, it still sounds very very good. :D And the other features, like being able to listen to a stream of music inspired by what you like, but that you've never heard before trumps everything. It's like that clerk from the record store who knows your musical tastes and is always suggesting bands you've never heard of.

And I'm not going to fall into the trap of discussing sound quality on VINYL versus BITS. 8)

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 1:45 am 
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Gerhard,

If you're using a moon dac, you may have to go to simaudio's website and download a driver for your computer.
On my Mac, then you have to go into settings and select the moon as the audio output.
Which moon CD player do you have?


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:26 am 
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James_W wrote:
I wouldn't be making any long term system or media decisions from a visit to an audio store. Newbie mistake. Explore the subject a bit more before committing to a point of view, good or bad. Most important is stick to the playback method you feel most comfortable with. For me it's a PC playing FLAC direct to a DAC.


I agree with this. "Exploring the subject a bit more", as I guess is being done with this very thread, is a fun way to learn about a new source option for our wonderful habit. Primarily, I too use a PC front end playing FLAC to my DAC, but I can also stream Spotify content through my DAC as well after learning how to set up a WMD driver in Windows that allows Spotify content to use the J-River Media Center settings to get the content to the DAC. But, it took a substantial amount of reading and trial/error to get me comfortable with this routine and I only stream Spotify when I'm hosting and people want to play music I may not own. I do believe my FLACs sound only slightly better than my premium Spotify subscription content, but sacrificing a tiny bit of quality for the convenience of having instant access to 44 million songs is a trade off I will easily make.

I know that some people, due to living space and financial reasons, have to choose one source method over another. Personally, as I'm not restricted to "either/or", I will play CD/Vinyl/Digital/Stream depending on circumstances and my mood. It's a wonderful time to be a music fan. Find one method that you like most and experiment/explore all of the others.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 4:58 am 
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I also have a PC for streaming, movies etc. and using a Sound Blaster sound card in it for the DAC.
This one: https://us.creative.com/p/sound-cards/sound-blaster-zxr

I personally am happy with the audio quality although I understand why people prefer external DACs. I also have a turntable with tube a preamp. Each media source have it's pros and cons in my opinion but I like both.

I've been thinking of replacing my sound card wit the Asus Essence STX II. Anyone here has any experience with that sound card and how it compares to the SB I currently have? Looking at the specs they're very similar, not sure if it's a worthy investment.
https://www.asus.com/ca-en/Sound-Cards/Essence_STX_II/


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 5:05 am 
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David_big_ears wrote:

Yikes. I guess I have to add the caveat that I'm a PC guy. I don't get Apple stuff at all. I'm not sure what a "Deezer desktop app" is. I just open a Chrome browser, and visit the Deezer.com website. Boom. Music plays. I can plug headphones into my Windows-based laptop or use USB to plug the laptop into my DAC. Don't Apple product use USB? If your DAC has USB input, it should just recognize the laptop, no? I thought that's what using USB was about. Sorry. Apple stuff always seems to have a different set of problems than PC, and historically, I've never been able to help anybody with Apple gear.


It's because Apple stuff either works or it doesn't. I find PC guys tend to like to tinker and over analyze and Apple guys just like stuff to work. I stream Spotify Premium with both PC and Mac but my main system is a Mac Mini running, yes, the Spotify and Deezer App. With Apple you have the option of using the Web on your browser or downloading a dedicated App to make the experience more personal and enjoyable.

If you choose an Apple product, just plug the DAC into the USB and select the DAC in system preferences as your output device, no drivers needed. If you have the volume icon in the task bar just right click (or option click) and select your DAC from there, done. You can go into Audio Midi and select higher bit rates usually up to 384 Kbps if your DAC supports it.

For free clients, Spotify has the best quality and for paid, Deezer is a bit ahead of Spotify for audio quality. I've heard Tidal at friends places and it's excellent but I keep waiting for an opportunity to try it with a no strings deal and if it's better than Spotify Premium I'll make the switch.

I find that CD vs streaming with a Premium service are very close and quality wise can go either way depending on the source. Streaming definitely gets the nod for selection and convenience.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:08 am 
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Gerhard, I have a few systems scattered around my life. Most systems are CD-based. I also have two systems that have turntables and I really enjoy them as well. I still find CD more consistently resolving than the varied quality of LPs, both new and used.

I tried a different approach in my office where I have a PC-driven system. I am driving the PC through an inexpensive HRT streaming DAC I picked up for $100 which connects via USB to the PC and via RCA to a Mystral DT-307B amp and a Pair of Mission bookshelf speakers. The sound is amazing. Better than CD and LPs.

My music choice? Youtube.....I find the quality better than Deezer (free service). Go figure.


Last edited by brownslane on Tue Jul 10, 2018 6:49 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 6:14 am 
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Thanks for the comments on Deezer guys..I do have the HiFi subscription absolutely fantastic for my Midfi system upstairs and as a matter of fact thats all I use....Unfortunately it still doesn't compete in the master system..

If I still can't get my Mac to implement it in another fashion, you might be getting a PM :).

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 7:05 am 
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Things keep changing...I spent considerable effort setting up a Mac server with about 20Tb of storage and ripped every CD and SACD I own. I set up a couple of Mac Mini's, one each in my two listening rooms (downstairs is my main dedicated listening room and upstairs in the living room for background music when I cook or entertain). I've tried various music players on my Mac finally settling on JRiver. Pure Music sounds better, but is a supreme hassle with hi res and FLAC files. The server makes a lot of noise in my office with the cooling fans, but it is reliable (this is my third server). This was my electronic music source for decent sound and convenience. My partner gave me an Amazon Echo on return from her last trip south....I did some research and selected Deezer as a streaming source over the others. I run the speaker output from the Echo to the AUX input on my receiver and I listen upstairs via the Echo...not sure how long the output in the Echo will drive my pre amp as a source but it sounds OK. It isn't audiophile but it is good enough for background listening. Having 20M files at your disposal is pretty incredible...there isn't much I want to listen to that isn't in the Deezer catalogue. And don't get me wrong...Deezer isn't perfect, but it is good enough for now. Downstairs in the dedicated room, there is no Deezer and the Mac player hasn't been on in a couple of years. The turntable hasn't been on much either in the past year or two...I've moved onto open reel tape. When I want to listen to music...analogue music...tape is where it is at.

I think getting to your comfort spot for listening to music is a journey; enjoy the trip, have patience and enjoy the music!

cheers,

Paul

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:16 am 
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Itsnotluck wrote:
Thanks for the comments on Deezer guys..I do have the HiFi subscription absolutely fantastic for my Midfi system upstairs and as a matter of fact thats all I use....Unfortunately it still doesn't compete in the master system..

If I still can't get my Mac to implement it in another fashion, you might be getting a PM :).


Feel free to message me or discuss in this thread anything you need regarding Apple and streaming.

Pete

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 9:59 am 
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This streaming thing is very interesting. David_Big_Ears explanation helped but is there a "Streaming for Complete Cavemen" book or articles we can follow?
And this may be the stupid question of the month (year,decade) Can you own streamed music?

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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 10:16 am 
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Thanks for all the helpful feedback everyone. I’ve decided to stay where I’m at now. Streaming is just something I’ve lost any interest in . I’ll keep listening to my vinyl and CDs. As far as Advance Electronics is concerned I’ve been very happy with their service and staff and fair prices over the years. Thanks again.


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PostPosted: Mon Jul 09, 2018 3:56 pm 
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Gerhard Roemer wrote:
Thanks for all the helpful feedback everyone. I’ve decided to stay where I’m at now. Streaming is just something I’ve lost any interest in . I’ll keep listening to my vinyl and CDs. As far as Advance Electronics is concerned I’ve been very happy with their service and staff and fair prices over the years. Thanks again.

I do the same cds vinyl no streaming is basically is convenience over beter sound I spend a lot time money to have the sound I like


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