Canuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio ForumCanuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio Forum
It is currently Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:30 pm

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 
Author Message
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 4:35 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
Does anybody have this set up?
Just to clarify, I have a line pre that has a mm phono stage (audible illusions mod3a) and I was considering the elevator.
I realize there can be other ways to do this (a sut) but my question is, has anybody used the elevator this way and what was the result?
thanks
Paul


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 5:29 pm 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Sun Mar 31, 2013 6:10 pm
Posts: 3050
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
I'm not sure I understand the question.
Are you asking if you can use a phono pre into the phono pre of your Audible Illusions?

_________________
"Switch on summer from a slot machine...
Yes get what you want cuz you can get anything..."


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 6:55 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
I'm talking about the gs elevator
https://www.musicdirect.com/preamp/grah ... pre-preamp
It is designed to plug into a gs mm phono pre and you will get different loading options using the elevator.
My question is, can you plug it into the onboard mmphono pre on your line pre and how well does it work and how will it sound.
Does that make better sense?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 8:10 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2006 4:43 pm
Posts: 572
Location: Ottawa, ON, CA
I'm slightly confused here...
The general definition of a line pre-amp, is that it only handles line level sources, in other words it has NO phono stage.

So if your mod3a pre-amp does have a mm phono stage, it's not a line pre-amp....

Assuming you do have a full pre-amp, and not just a line pre-amp, then the elevator will convert the mm phono stage to a moving coil (mc) phono stage. I haven't used this particular unit, but I have used other active pre-preamps of it's sort with good results. You mention SUT's, or step up transformers. Generally they have a lower noise floor, but personally I've never been a huge fan of interstage transformers. Good ones work well, poor ones not so much. A transformer cannot create power, only alter the voltage and current, so by stepping up the voltage, you reduce the current, which may, or may not work with the subsequent stage. Some experimentation is required....

Cheers, Dave


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sat Nov 18, 2017 10:27 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Mar 18, 2007 2:01 pm
Posts: 1044
Location: Calgary, AB, CA
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Does anybody have this set up?
Just to clarify, I have a line pre that has a mm phono stage (audible illusions mod3a) and I was considering the elevator.
I realize there can be other ways to do this (a sut) but my question is, has anybody used the elevator this way and what was the result?
thanks
Paul


I've used it before with my SFP1 phono stage using the BenzMicro L04 low output MC cartridge. If I remember correctly I was using the 200 ohms loading on it and the sound was very neutral and highly resolving, but missing a bit on the inner detail. You also have to remember that the SFP1 was a good phono stage, to begin with. However, adding the GS SUT on the chain certainly improved the sound by quite a bit.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
Thanks for the clarification Dave, I'm the one that is confused :D

To take it a step further, is there an alternative to the graham slee? In my limited experience, it would seem this add on pre phono pre is unique to GS. Although debatable, it's regarded as a quality piece.
Any other companies make something similar, or better?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 6:21 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:20 am
Posts: 4398
Location: London, ON, CA
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Thanks for the clarification Dave, I'm the one that is confused :D

To take it a step further, is there an alternative to the graham slee? In my limited experience, it would seem this add on pre phono pre is unique to GS. Although debatable, it's regarded as a quality piece.
Any other companies make something similar, or better?


The Elevator is not unique, and my first impression is that it is very expensive. Graham Slee products are excellent, but there are other (active) prepreamplifiers and (passive) transformers on the market to connect low-output moving coil cartridges to moving magnet phono preamps. I use a Bryston TF-1 with an Ortofon MC20 Super (LOMC), but the Ortofon T-20 transformer is also a good choice for this cartridge. What moving coil phono cartridge are you planning to use? That is the first place to start.

_________________
1978 Rickenbacker 4001, 2010 Gibson Thunderbird, and Dean Fretless Basses;
1987 Guild Nightbird, 2000 Taylor 310KCE, and Godin 5th Avenue Guitars.

If you can use one of those newfangled Internets, you can post photos in your damn classified ads. :roll:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:01 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Jan 13, 2011 11:29 am
Posts: 499
Location: St.Catharines, ON, CA
I thought there was some John Curl designed MC boards available for that preamp.

Gary


Attachments:
Audible_I_Modulus3_phono.JPG
Audible_I_Modulus3_phono.JPG [ 95.13 KiB | Viewed 374 times ]
Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:21 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 21, 2011 1:18 pm
Posts: 885
Location: St. John's, NL, CA
I had contemplated getting an Elevator when I upgraded to LOMC for my Slee Era Gold. But, the cost was quite high, so I wound up trying out a couple step ups for a fraction of the price and decide which I liked more. I assume your MOD3A is an active pre-amp, not just a line stage? I'm not familiar with Audible Illusions gear, but I would imagine it would work fine. Would it be a good match? All depends on the cart, and how the Slee interacts with your gear.

I found my Dyna 10x HOMC did not sound good at all with my Era Gold. Sounded great on my Yaqin tube phono. One would assume 47kohm would be 47k ohm and it wouldn't matter much... But, apparently there must be a difference somewhere between the two phonos...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 7:47 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
Quadzilla wrote:
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Thanks for the clarification Dave, I'm the one that is confused :D

To take it a step further, is there an alternative to the graham slee? In my limited experience, it would seem this add on pre phono pre is unique to GS. Although debatable, it's regarded as a quality piece.
Any other companies make something similar, or better?


The Elevator is not unique, and my first impression is that it is very expensive. Graham Slee products are excellent, but there are other (active) prepreamplifiers and (passive) transformers on the market to connect low-output moving coil cartridges to moving magnet phono preamps. I use a Bryston TF-1 with an Ortofon MC20 Super (LOMC), but the Ortofon T-20 transformer is also a good choice for this cartridge. What moving coil phono cartridge are you planning to use? That is the first place to start.

Thanks for that Quad. I'm not sure what cart I'm going to use, that is why I was considering the elevator because of it's wide variety of loading options.

-- 19 Nov 2017 15:52 --

sasquatch wrote:
I thought there was some John Curl designed MC boards available for that preamp.

Gary

That's an option too Gary. Again, I was looking for a degree of versatility. I would have to do some research.

-- 19 Nov 2017 16:02 --

therealco wrote:
I had contemplated getting an Elevator when I upgraded to LOMC for my Slee Era Gold. But, the cost was quite high, so I wound up trying out a couple step ups for a fraction of the price and decide which I liked more. I assume your MOD3A is an active pre-amp, not just a line stage? I'm not familiar with Audible Illusions gear, but I would imagine it would work fine. Would it be a good match? All depends on the cart, and how the Slee interacts with your gear.

I found my Dyna 10x HOMC did not sound good at all with my Era Gold. Sounded great on my Yaqin tube phono. One would assume 47kohm would be 47k ohm and it wouldn't matter much... But, apparently there must be a difference somewhere between the two phonos...

Yes, it is an active pre.
I have the same cart as you, and I found the 47k ohm to be too high for it.
I'm currently using a ps audio gcph, but I have it going through the aux. I have run the dv through the mm stage on the AI pre, but I didn't like the sound, not enough gain. It sounds great through the ps audio.
What I want to do it use the phono stage on the pre and have the ability to adjust the load settings for different carts (HOMC, LOMC)


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 8:46 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Jun 12, 2006 8:20 am
Posts: 4398
Location: London, ON, CA
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Thanks for that Quad. I'm not sure what cart I'm going to use, that is why I was considering the elevator because of it's wide variety of loading options.


That variety of loading options can be good or it could be bad. It is good to have options. My Bryston has them, but they are internally hard-wired so not that convenient to change.

The downside of all those switches is that so many of them in the signal path can degrade the sound, especially over time as they get dirty ... especially if you set them and leave them. Switches that are never switched (say that a few times fast) can get 'cemented' in place by gunk from the air. Just imagine leaving the volume control in the same position for several years.

Another option to consider is a dedicated moving coil phono preamp. I also have a Rega Fono MC, which has internal DIP switches for loading options. I have to say though, that they make very little difference to the sound. It is a nice little unit, and a fraction of the price of the Elevator. You should be able to get a used one for under $200. Just connect it to a line input on your preamp and not use the MM phono stage.

_________________
1978 Rickenbacker 4001, 2010 Gibson Thunderbird, and Dean Fretless Basses;
1987 Guild Nightbird, 2000 Taylor 310KCE, and Godin 5th Avenue Guitars.

If you can use one of those newfangled Internets, you can post photos in your damn classified ads. :roll:


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 9:23 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Mon Oct 17, 2011 6:55 pm
Posts: 1911
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Dynavector recommends loading of >1Kohms for the 10X – 47Kohms, although will work might be a tad high. I ran mine at 1K

Graham Slee does not recommend HOMC for the Elevator. 0.15 to 0.8mV so the 10X would not be a good match


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 11:06 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
sthomas1049 wrote:
Dynavector recommends loading of >1Kohms for the 10X – 47Kohms, although will work might be a tad high. I ran mine at 1K

Graham Slee does not recommend HOMC for the Elevator. 0.15 to 0.8mV so the 10X would not be a good match

There is the answer.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Sun Nov 19, 2017 1:32 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Aug 15, 2010 10:38 pm
Posts: 1156
Location: Saskatoon, SK, CA
The phono section on the M3A is pretty hot. You will not need much of a step up to use low output MC cartridges. I've used as little as a 1 mv high output MC with excellent results.

_________________
1963 Fender Precision Bass
Ampeg SVT and Ampeg 8x10 cabinet


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:34 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 13, 2015 9:36 am
Posts: 400
Location: scarborough, ON, CA
The Glass Prison wrote:
The phono section on the M3A is pretty hot. You will not need much of a step up to use low output MC cartridges. I've used as little as a 1 mv high output MC with excellent results.


That's true, I had an exact II and it was just too 'hot'. Made me sort of hate the cart.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 15 posts ] 

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: dlodewyk, Google Adsense [Bot] and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
cron
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group