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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 4:59 pm 
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Good day everyone,

After an eternally long 18 years, I have finally acquired the above revered combination Sansui system. I bit the bullet and purchased a fully restored set from the USA. The seller was outstanding in his understanding of CAD/USD rates, duties, customs relating to cross-border shipping. To sum up, the fellow was more Canadian in attitude than American.

The system is due to be delivered on Friday 21/09/2017 My course of actiom this year has been to downsize considerably. My core system will remain with the addition of a pair of Tannoy 12" Gold Monitors housed in custom Onken walnut cabinets.

The Sansui will be the power source for a Nakamichi tape deck, Sony CDP-250 and drive a pair of Ohm Walsh 4 omni-directinal speakers. The Ohms are what cause me some concern. Up until now, these have been driven by a dual monobloc Robertson Audio Sixty Ten amplifier at 200W/channel. The Ohms are not highly efficient at 89 dB. They are power hungry but barely strained the Robertson monster. Finally you say, the question: Does anyone in this audience have any experience with this scenario? Speakers requiring gobs of power at only 89 dB efficiency. Will the Sansui AU-717 have enough reserve power to drive the speakers?

Thanks for any comments, suggestions and opinions.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:17 pm 
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Location: Brampton, ON, CA
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I'd leave the cover off!

Second thought better leave it on to catch the drool.

Congrats! Will want to hear that setup for sure.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:33 pm 
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Thank you ae86 for the photograph. It will look good in my Album of Sansui gear.
The photos that I have of my system were not taken in natural light as this one was.
They still reveal the excellent condition of the units themselves.
Both the integrated amplifier and the tuner sport the rack handles.

FedEx tracking advises me that the system is in Woodbridge/Vaughan: 31.7 km from my front door.
I will have the full system operational by this time tomorrow.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 5:58 pm 
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Your Walsh 4 has 6 or 8 ohm impedance and 87dB or 89dB/watt, depending on which part of their website you read it from.

The AU-717 is rated at 85 Wrms into 8 ohms. With the full 85W (19.3dB1W) from the AU-717 driving your Walsh if its impedance is 8 ohms flat across the audio band, the resulting sound is 106.3 or 108.3 dBspl before the AU-717 protection kicks in, theoretically.

If your listening level is more than this then the AU-717 will need a more efficient speaker.


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:27 pm 
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ej251awd wrote:
The AU-717 is rated at 85 Wrms into 8 ohms. With the full 85W (19.3dB1W) from the AU-717 driving your Walsh if its impedance is 8 ohms flat across the audio band, the resulting sound is 106.3 or 108.3 dBspl before the AU-717 protection kicks in, theoretically.

ej251awd, you just gave me the equivalent of a therapeutic dose of Valium.
My preference is a 2.5 oz shot of Jura Superstition Single Malt Scotch.

Taken from an internet Decibel Equivalent Table (what's how loud):

85dB: Beginning of hearing damage range, ear plugs should be worn.

My Sansui AU-717 will have horsepower to spare as I don't listen/playback at the 85dB level for any longer
than perhaps 20 to 30 seconds. Reaching a level of 106.3 dB where I live will never happen.

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PostPosted: Wed Sep 20, 2017 6:51 pm 
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Madcap wrote:
ej251awd, you just gave me the equivalent of a therapeutic dose of Valium.


That is one of the intent :)

I rebuilt an AU-717 a while back and the guy used it on his Legacy Audio Focus which are 4 ohms and 96dB/watt. He was getting the AU-717 into protection mode at his preferred listening level. Mind you his speakers are nominally 4 ohms.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 2:40 am 
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ej251awd wrote:
I rebuilt an AU-717 a while back and the guy used it on his Legacy Audio Focus which are 4 ohms and 96dB/watt. He was getting the AU-717 into protection mode at his preferred listening level. Mind you his speakers are nominally 4 ohms.

Luckily for ol' Madcap, your customer lives in BC! Athough, on some winter nights of a Full Moon, I can almost pick up the sounds of some Led Zeppelin wafting through my windows from the West.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 7:09 am 
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Madcap wrote:
ej251awd wrote:
I rebuilt an AU-717 a while back and the guy used it on his Legacy Audio Focus which are 4 ohms and 96dB/watt. He was getting the AU-717 into protection mode at his preferred listening level. Mind you his speakers are nominally 4 ohms.

Luckily for ol' Madcap, your customer lives in BC! Athough, on some winter nights of a Full Moon, I can almost pick up the sounds of some Led Zeppelin wafting through my windows from the West.


The AU-717 is actually living in Carson, California languishing in his master's garage unplugged. I visited it 3 weeks ago and was dismayed by the lack of attention it's getting given the amount of time I spent rebuilding and fixing its original flaws. I thought maybe it got damaged in shipping but it was all good as I checked the offset and bias while I was there.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 7:45 am 
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Quote:
The AU-717 is actually living in Carson, California languishing in his master's garage unplugged. I visited it 3 weeks ago and was dismayed by the lack of attention it's getting given the amount of time I spent rebuilding and fixing its original flaws. I thought maybe it got damaged in shipping but it was all good as I checked the offset and bias while I was there

This guy reminds me of my first trip to my employer's Head Office in Orange County, Southern California.

After a full day of pointless meetings, a group of us were sampling the local eye candy and drinks in one of those "cookie cutter bars" like a TGIF. One local customer addressed me and said: "Canadian are yuh? How do you like our paradise down here?" Without batting an eye I replied: "Two observations only. The air here IS orange and number two: Y'all have suntan oil between the ears!" He turned on one heel and slithered away....

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 9:59 am 
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I still have my AU-717/TU-717 and at one point I paired them with the B&W 805....the 805 has an impedance curve that drops down to 3.7 ohms and efficiency rating of 88 dB so not quite as demanding to drive as your Ohm Walsh 4 are but still a speaker that likes good clean power. From my memory of that setup the Sansui was a surprisingly strong performer and was capable of driving the 805 S to as loud as I dared to go without any issues.

Let us know how you make out....


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:17 am 
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Considering that your average dinner party produces room SPLs in excess of 85 dB, I don't find very convincing the "statistic" that extended exposure to 85 dB causes or can cause hearing loss.

As for the Sansui 717 series, my only experience dates from the 1970s. I had convinced a friend who was earning good money to invest in a pair of 15" Tannoy Monitor Golds. We were enjoying them with his AU717, but they just didn't sound as vivid and "live" as we had heard them in the shop.

So we switched in my Quad 33/303 pre-power combo, rated at about half the power output as the Sansui, and voila!, the cone movement was reduced by 75%, and that blissful "you are there" quality with all its space and detail returned. As soon as my friend managed to sell his Sansui, we went back to the shop and got him a brand-new Quad 33/303 set-up of his own (at that time just over $400).

Nowadays, I find that the more power available to the speakers, even at modest SPLs, the better they sound. In the system I'm currently working on, which specs out to around 100 dB sensitivity, I'm supplying 800 Wrms per channel to the subwoofers (below 100 Hz) and 650 Wrms to the mid-high modules. Granted, though, I have an unusually large listening room.

In the case of my reference speakers, which are active—Meyer Sound Labs X-10 monitors + X-400C subs—the manufacturer supplies 500 Wpc to the 18" subs (below 50 Hz), 1250 Wpc to the 15" mid-bass (50-900 Hz), and 600 Wpc to the horns (900-17,000 Hz).

My rule of thumb has become: where quality is comparable, always choose more power over less!


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 10:26 am 
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okanaudio wrote:
not quite as demanding to drive as your Ohm Walsh 4 are but still a speaker that likes good clean power. From my memory of that setup the Sansui was a surprisingly strong performer and was capable of driving the 805 S to as loud as I dared to go without any issues.

Let us know how you make out....

The Universe is truly shining down on Madcap today. My Sansui AU-717 and TU-717 arrived via FedEx at exactly 12:15 today (21/09/2017) from the Boston area. My seller in MA is a wizard. The two boxes were triple walled, with enough bubble bags and other padding to make a spare bed!

The bottom line: I have been listening to JazzFM 91.1 for well over 2 hours now, sipping gleefully on my fave beer: Innis & Gunn. The Celestion Ditton 44 were the first to be driven by the AU-717. Blew me over! Never has any Ditton 44 that I have owned (8 pairs in 10 years) ever sounded so smooth, musical and completely fluid in reproducing the highs down to the lows that FM transmissions can deliver. Limited as FM stations are, they are still respectable in a background music scenario.

The moment of truth: I connected my Ohm Walsh 4 next. Holy "Ess Aitch Eye Tee" This time I poured mysellf a stiff shot of Jura Superstition Single Malt Scotch and just marvelled at the sound emanating from those big Ohm towers. I haven't ventured past the 12 O'clock point on the Volume dial yet and won't need have to. This Sansui AU-717 is one sleeper of an amplifier, underrated vis-a-vis its power output. Seventh heaven is where you'll find Madcap for the next 10 hours and probably more as friends dribble in to drink my beer. Hands off my Single Malt guys!

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 11:26 am 
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dr.joe wrote:
Considering that your average dinner party produces room SPLs in excess of 85 dB, I don't find very convincing the "statistic" that extended exposure to 85 dB causes or can cause hearing loss. Nowadays, I find that the more power available to the speakers, even at modest SPLs, the better they sound. In the system I'm currently working on, which specs out to around 100 dB sensitivity, I'm supplying 800 Wrms per channel to the subwoofers (below 100 Hz) and 650 Wrms to the mid-high modules. Granted, though, I have an unusually large listening room. My rule of thumb has become: where quality is comparable, always choose more power over less!


dr.joe, my Medicine Man!
I can fully appreciate a room full of partying, drinking, loud people. Those days are so far behind me that I can't conceive of ever having partaken in those wild assemblies. That being said, I will be affected by SPLs even at 86 dB in my listening room which is large by today's cookie cutter condos of 650 sq ft

My Sansui system arrived today (21/09/2017) at 12:15 sharp via FedEx from Boston, MA. I have been listening to JazzFM 91.1 for the better part of 3 hours as I write. The first to experience the power of the Sansui AU-717 were my Celestion Ditton 44. Never has a pair of mine (from 11 pairs owned in the past 10 years) sounded so smooth, musical and faithful in reproducing the limited frequencies of today's FM radio stations. Round One to Sansui.

My apprehension level rose as I prepared to connect my Ohm Walsh 4 towers. I opted to play a CD player (my first ever, the Meridian MCD Pro by Boothroyd Stuart 1985) through the AU-717 for a change of pace. I must say that I am blown away at the reserve power of the integrated amplifier that Sansui introduced almost 40 years ago. The Ohms are as happy as larks, pounding out that gut punching low end as only they can do. I now sit comfortably, sipping on a double shot of Jura Superstition Single Malt Scotch, listening to the music and to hell with the specs of the equipment.

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 12:01 pm 
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Madcap,

Glad to hear the new gear is working for you; enjoyment is the only thing that counts in the end.

[But I don't recall saying anything about partying and drinking! Just a few guys in a rec room spinning LPs. . .]


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 21, 2017 1:23 pm 
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Madcap wrote:
The Universe is truly shining down on Madcap today. My Sansui AU-717 and TU-717 arrived via FedEx at exactly 12:15 today (21/09/2017) from the Boston area. My seller in MA is a wizard. The two boxes were triple walled, with enough bubble bags and other padding to make a spare bed!

The bottom line: I have been listening to JazzFM 91.1 for well over 2 hours now, sipping gleefully on my fave beer: Innis & Gunn. The Celestion Ditton 44 were the first to be driven by the AU-717. Blew me over! Never has any Ditton 44 that I have owned (8 pairs in 10 years) ever sounded so smooth, musical and completely fluid in reproducing the highs down to the lows that FM transmissions can deliver. Limited as FM stations are, they are still respectable in a background music scenario.

The moment of truth: I connected my Ohm Walsh 4 next. Holy "Ess Aitch Eye Tee" This time I poured mysellf a stiff shot of Jura Superstition Single Malt Scotch and just marvelled at the sound emanating from those big Ohm towers. I haven't ventured past the 12 O'clock point on the Volume dial yet and won't need have to. This Sansui AU-717 is one sleeper of an amplifier, underrated vis-a-vis its power output. Seventh heaven is where you'll find Madcap for the next 10 hours and probably more as friends dribble in to drink my beer. Hands off my Single Malt guys!


Very glad to hear you are enjoying your new gear!

In my case (back at the time) I was using a McIntosh MA6900 Integrated Amp. on my then new B&W 805S - I ended up selling the Mac to buy a Musical Fidelity kW 500 Integrated amp. I inserted the AU-717 as a temporary piece until the Musical Fidelity Amp. arrived. Although I was expecting a downgrade in sound from the Mac. it was temporarily replacing I ended up being very pleasantly surprised. Probably the reason why I have not bought any Mac. gear since and have always kept the AU-717 to this very day. I even ended up doing the legendary Minsoo Kim modification to it but that is a story for a different day. Enjoy!


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