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 Post subject: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 3:49 am 
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Location: Rockwood, ON, CA
Interesting. For a change this morning, I switched from Tidal to Spotify for my morning coffee and Lute playlist. I air streamed from my iPad (upgraded to IOS 11) to my Auralic Aries. Surprisingly I thought the Spotify VOGG ORBIS stream seem to have a little more clarity and dynamics than Tidal FLAC. Soundstage seemed a little deeper too. I did not feel any detail was missing on familiar pieces. A bit of a surprise for me. Anyone else experienced this?

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:09 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Although i have not had the pleasure of Tidal yet i do stream Spotify from my smartphone into a Digital Link lll Dac and enjoy it very much.
I usually listen to Rock or Folk but last nite listened to a compilation meant to evaluate speaker performance.
Being that i am somewhat of a purist in equipment i have been using an Axiom 1 passive pre and the results with my Dac are great.

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 4:29 am 
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Location: Riverview, NB, CA
Funny, I had subscriptions to both and found the sound from Tidal to be better in regards to detail and soundstage in my room. I found both to be very enjoyable. However, I found the differences to be overcome by the ease of use of Spotify and the ability to use my iPad as a control device through Spotify Connect. I also really enjoy the Daily Mix feature and the suggestions for new music.
I use a dedicated HP PC- PeachTree X-1 - Simaudio 100D- Alabaster Sonneteer-PSB T2's.


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 5:15 am 
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Location: Dodge City, NB, CA
I've never used Tidal but have been using Spotify for quite a while and I find it to be more than up to the job. As David said it's very easy to use. I run it from my IPad through a SONO's connect.

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:36 am 
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Joined: Mon May 18, 2009 8:09 am
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Location: Ottawa, ON, CA
Have not tried Tidal, but am a Spotify diehard. I did a/b vs my flac files ripped onto my pc and the difference was quite obvious. Three other people concurred on separate occasions. My dac, aWeiss 202, is quite revealing however.

I love Spotify and use it in the car relentlessly. :D :D


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:51 am 
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Location: Regina, SK, CA
I've had TIDAL for a long time now and a while back I had a free premium trial of Spotify. In terms of pure sound quality, TIDAL was easily superior, IMHO. However, I think Spotify is definitely much better for finding new music and just playing random music based on genres, mood, etc. But, for me, the sound quality difference means I only use TIDAL.

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 6:58 am 
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I agree that Spotify can cause you to put down what ever you're doing and marvel at how good the sound really is. While I listen to all types of music, my main diet is classical. At the moment I'm listening to a new release of Krystian Zimerman playing Schubert piano sonatas to evaluate whether or not I should buy the 24/96 download on ProStudioMasters. I'm a bit conflicted not because I don't like the recording but more from the standpoint that Spotify's quality makes me wonder if I really need anything better. I will buy the download to support the artist and label but for most I expect Spotify would suffice.

For those what have not tried it recently, give it another shot. Spotify has made improvements to the sound quality by reducing the playback levels.


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 7:24 am 
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Joined: Sun Apr 23, 2006 9:29 am
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Location: Simcoe, ON, CA
I use Spotify and am quite happy with it . I will try tidal and others at some point but no rush to do so . Stream through Chromecast audio set to full dynamic range and Spotify set to extreme .


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 8:13 am 
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Location: Winnipeg, MB, CA
I've been a Spotify subscriber for awhile now and did try Tidal on a trial basis. I agree that Tidal was better sound quality overall, but given the price difference being twice the price of Spotify it better be. I've since ended the Tidal trial and will continue with Spotify based on ease of use (control from iPad is hard to beat) and the discovery selections/mixes which are pretty decent. I'm not ditching my music collection, but when we just need background/social gathering use it's pretty good.... and I do agree Spotify has improved the quality of their playback.

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 9:40 am 
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Location: greely, ON, CA
I am also quite happy with Spotify and it's simplicity for a non techie. I stream through a Bluesound Node 2 and control it with my Android phone - as simple as it can get. Also got my wife setup on her phone and she loves it as well - we both use cable music selections a lot less now. As others have said, the daily playlists are great - I have 6 available every day as well as Release Radar - which is a weekly release of new music. For my ears, the sound is more than satisfactory.


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:04 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:18 pm
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Location: Sooke, BC, CA
milesian wrote:
Interesting. For a change this morning, I switched from Tidal to Spotify for my morning coffee and Lute playlist. I air streamed from my iPad (upgraded to IOS 11) to my Auralic Aries. Surprisingly I thought the Spotify VOGG ORBIS stream seem to have a little more clarity and dynamics than Tidal FLAC. Soundstage seemed a little deeper too. I did not feel any detail was missing on familiar pieces. A bit of a surprise for me. Anyone else experienced this?


Being I big fan of all things open source, especially as they apply to HiFi I am happy that you are getting good sound from the OGG VORBIS bit stream. Vorbis like flac can be configured to run at different bit rates. I'll see if I can get a free trial from spotify and report back what bit rate they are transmitting at.

You may be interested in the following which I pasted from wikipedia:

Quote:
Listening tests[edit]
See also: Codec listening test § Results
Listening tests are normally carried out as ABX tests, i.e., the listener has to identify an unknown sample X as being A or B, with A (the original) and B (the encoded version) available for reference. The outcome of a test must be statistically significant. This setup ensures that the listener is not biased by his/her expectations, and that the outcome is very unlikely to be the result of chance. If sample X can be identified reliably, the listener can assign a score as a subjective judgment of the quality. Otherwise, the encoded version is considered to be transparent. Below are links to several listening test results.

2005, July comparison - AAC vs MP3 vs Vorbis vs WMA at 80 kbit/s. States that Vorbis aoTuV beta 4 is the best encoder for either classical or various music in this bitrate, and that its quality is comparable to the LAME ABR MP3 at 128 kbit/s.[33]
2005, August comparison - AAC vs MP3 vs Vorbis vs WMA at 96 kbit/s. States that Vorbis aoTuV beta 4 and AAC are tied as the best encoders for classical music in this bitrate, while aoTuV beta 4 is the best encoder for pop music, even better than LAME at 128 kbit/s.[34]
2005, August comparison - MPC vs Vorbis vs MP3 vs AAC at 180 kbit/s. An audiophile listening test, which states that, for classical music, Vorbis aoTuV beta 4 has 93% percent probability of being the best encoder, tied with MPC. MPC is tied with both Vorbis, in the first place, and LAME in the second.[35]
2011, April comparison by Hydrogenaudio - Vorbis vs HE-AAC vs Opus at 64 kbit/s. Vorbis was on average between the LC-AAC low anchor and Nero HE-AAC, while the upcoming Opus (by Xiph) was best.[36]
Characteristic artifacts[edit]

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:18 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
The big thing with Spotify is that you need to make sure it's being streamed at Extreme Quality, which is 320 kbps. I had a setting on my iPhone that when I downloaded for offline or wasn't in Wifi, it was downloading at standard quality, which is 96 kbps, which is passable when in a loud car, but unacceptable to me when using headphones. I've recently picked up an Onkyo DP-X1A DAP, which has lots of space (via Micro SD) to download offline in Extreme Quality, which will be ideal for transit commutes.

I've only played with Tidal briefly, but the Spotify interface is quite easy, though I do miss Rdio, which had the cleanest/easiest interface of anything I've used.


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:29 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
I wish Spotify would release their HiFi tier already


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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 10:46 am 
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Joined: Sun Nov 11, 2012 2:18 pm
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Location: Sooke, BC, CA
Good news and bad news:

GOOD: There is a prebuilt spotify client on my OS: Linux Mint.
BAD: They want my credit card for premium.

They lost me when they asked for my card.

In any case if you wish to experiment there is a free hires classical music stream out of Czechoslovakia:

http://amp.cesnet.cz:8000/cro-d-dur-256.ogg

Here is the resolution data on the bitstream:

Codec: Vorbis Audio (vorb)
Sample rate: 48000 Hz
Bitrate: 224 kb/s

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 Post subject: Re: Spotify and Tidal
PostPosted: Sat Sep 09, 2017 11:42 am 
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Joined: Tue Apr 05, 2011 4:51 pm
Posts: 509
Location: Mont St-Hilaire, QC, CA
Everest Audio wrote:
I've had TIDAL for a long time now and a while back I had a free premium trial of Spotify. In terms of pure sound quality, TIDAL was easily superior, IMHO. However, I think Spotify is definitely much better for finding new music and just playing random music based on genres, mood, etc. But, for me, the sound quality difference means I only use TIDAL.

This, exactly.
Running Tidal Hifi since it was launched. Seemless integration with my server/streamer as a bonus. Some old stuff are not good but most of the recent stuff is very good. To be honest, cannot hear the difference with a 16/44 rip from dbPoweramp.

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