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 Post subject: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:36 am 
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Location: Ingersoll, ON, CA
A friend dropped by last week and we were talking about what we had been up to lately. As usual he had been fixing his fancy P.I.A. British car (a Triumph convertible).
The car is glorious for the two or three weeks it actually runs. The rest of the time it is in a constant state of being repaired or rebuilt.
I wouldn't have one if they gave them away. The constant need for repairs would be a major deal breaker.
I feel the same way about most things.
Reliability is an important part of the purchase decision.
It would seem though a lot of people disagree, Stereophile among them.
An amp they were reviewing failed several times during testing and reviewing and was recommended despite the failures because it sounded great when it worked. :shock:
The question I have is this, A component is absolutely wonderful. The best sounding thing you've ever had in your system,
but it breaks down a lot and is out of service for months at a time.
Do you put up with it or get rid of it?

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:41 am 
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Joined: Wed Aug 08, 2012 4:17 pm
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Location: Winnipeg, MB, CA
I purchase components to deliver the music. If they are failing to do so on a regular basis then they fail to do the job I acquired them for.


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:49 am 
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Location: London, ON, CA
A while back, I had a Triumph TR7. It was a very cool little car, but a massive PITA. I couldn't play the radio because if the car heard that it was raining somewhere in the world it would stall. I can't remember both headlights popping up at the same time, and most of the electrical connections were simply pathetic. My experience with British hifi gear isn't much better. I can't understand why British amplifiers need recapping after 10 or 12 years when components in much cheaper Japanese gear last MUCH longer than that.

Why do the British drink warm beer? Lucas makes refrigerators.

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:54 am 
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Location: checked out
If a product breaks down all the time, it means it was poorly designed, or you’re using it outside its design parameters. I wouldn’t use it.


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:55 am 
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Posts: 658
Location: Montréal, QC, CA
mpublicover wrote:
I purchase components to deliver the music. If they are failing to do so on a regular basis then they fail to do the job I acquired them for.
+ 1

It's why audio forums are important. It is relatively easy to find a component's reliability through them.
Before buying.

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:59 am 
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Location: Dodge City, NB, CA
I own a Harley because it makes me giggle. I also own a Suzuki and a Honda because they're both better motorcycles. I've owned several Brit bikes and all of them including my 1970 Norton Commando were as reliable as my Japanese bikes. Now as far as audio stuff goes the only piece of slightly annoying kit I ever owned was a ModWright KWA150 and I sold it. Wasn't because it was a bit unreliable though ( it overheated to easily ). It was because it was too big to fit in my rack. Missed it so much that I added a ModWright KWI200 to my collection and it's a keeper.

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Last edited by KJT1 on Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:01 am, edited 2 times in total.

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 8:59 am 
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Location: Smalltown, ON, CA
Lucas............Prince of Darkness!

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:01 am 
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davinci_redux wrote:
Lucas............Prince of Darkness!


Jaguar came out with a 2+2 version of the XKE so that the mechanic wouldn't have to ride in the trunk.

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1987 Guild Nightbird, 2000 Taylor 310KCE, and Godin 5th Avenue Guitars.

Don't blame your Millennials for doing nothing. You did tell them they could do anything they wanted to do.


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:05 am 
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Posts: 428
Location: toronto, ON, CA
Motor vehicles are exposed to the outdoor elements.
Extreme weather,road conditions ,etc.

I had an MGB convertible with a Rover V8 engine.
Same thing,high maintenance.

Most audio equipment sits in a controlled environment
Reliability issues are mostly design flaws


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:07 am 
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Joined: Mon Feb 13, 2017 4:46 pm
Posts: 200
Location: Guelph, ON, CA
mahatma1 wrote:
A friend dropped by last week and we were talking about what we had been up to lately. As usual he had been fixing his fancy P.I.A. British car (a Triumph convertible).
The car is glorious for the two or three weeks it actually runs. The rest of the time it is in a constant state of being repaired or rebuilt.
I wouldn't have one if they gave them away. The constant need for repairs would be a major deal breaker.
I feel the same way about most things.
Reliability is an important part of the purchase decision.
It would seem though a lot of people disagree, Stereophile among them.
An amp they were reviewing failed several times during testing and reviewing and was recommended despite the failures because it sounded great when it worked. :shock:
The question I have is this, A component is absolutely wonderful. The best sounding thing you've ever had in your system,
but it breaks down a lot and is out of service for months at a time.
Do you put up with it or get rid of it?


My Dad always said , “ If you want to find a good reliable appliance, don’t call a salesman , call the repair shop “


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:10 am 
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Location: London, ON, CA
natalie wrote:
Motor vehicles are exposed to the outdoor elements.
Extreme weather,road conditions ,etc.

I had an MGB convertible with a Rover V8 engine.
Same thing,high maintenance.

Most audio equipment sits in a controlled environment
Reliability issues are mostly design flaws


Cars that aren't designed to drive in the elements are flawed designs too.

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1978 Rickenbacker 4001, 2010 Gibson Thunderbird, and Dean Fretless Basses;
1987 Guild Nightbird, 2000 Taylor 310KCE, and Godin 5th Avenue Guitars.

Don't blame your Millennials for doing nothing. You did tell them they could do anything they wanted to do.


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:17 am 
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Joined: Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:18 pm
Posts: 665
Location: Thornhill, ON, CA
When you buy vintage British cars, you know full well what you are getting into. The best way to get them to work properly is a full restoration, right down to sandblasting the frame. On the car forum that I am involved in there's a guy in London ON that does full body on frame restorations on Austin Healys, MG Midgets and similar as a hobby. He puts the whole stripped down body on a rotisserie to do the resto. That's a huge job but his cars are amazing.

What is his daily driver? A Scion FR-S, which he abuses and doesn't baby at all. He is intelligent enough to realize his pristine cars are showpieces and that any car that has been abused for years (including his Scion) can be restored in one huge effort.

Like anything else, when you are getting into a fixer upper, know what you're getting into.

PS My system includes a British Fidelity (Musical Fidelity had copyright issues in the 80s in NA) P270 Class A amp and The Preamp 1a. Nothing has been restored and it still sounds amazing. The 8 big Elna 22000 pF power supply caps are still perfect. Only Deoxit on the 1 rheostat and I was good as new. The country of origin is not necessarily the determining factor for quality parts.

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:24 am 
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I've always strongly felt that reliability should be factored into gear reviews.
There are a few "mid-fi" brands that get great reviews, and listed as "bang for the buck" items, that are notorious for reliability issues.

Yet these brands still survive and carry on using cheap parts.

One such brand is listed in one of my distributors inventory, it is ridiculous how many refurb items come up in there constantly.

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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 9:33 am 
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Forbes_2 wrote:
I've always strongly felt that reliability should be factored into gear reviews.
There are a few "mid-fi" brands that get great reviews, and listed as "bang for the buck" items, that are notorious for reliability issues.

Yet these brands still survive and carry on using cheap parts.

One such brand is listed in one of my distributors inventory, it is ridiculous how many refurb items come up in there constantly.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


You just have to look in the Classifieds. The same brands seem to come up. Cambridge Audio comes to mind when it comes to refurbs.

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1978 Rickenbacker 4001, 2010 Gibson Thunderbird, and Dean Fretless Basses;
1987 Guild Nightbird, 2000 Taylor 310KCE, and Godin 5th Avenue Guitars.

Don't blame your Millennials for doing nothing. You did tell them they could do anything they wanted to do.


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 Post subject: Re: Product reliability
PostPosted: Mon Feb 19, 2018 10:09 am 
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Joined: Fri Mar 30, 2007 9:41 am
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Location: Ingersoll, ON, CA
I bought a Cambridge Audio cd player(CD 651) It was/is intended to be a stop gap until I can get something I really like. I was concerned enough about it's reliability that I negotiated an extra year warranty in it's price. I started at three years but the sales guy wouldn't stop laughing.
Surprisingly, the cd player while not outstanding in any particular area, has proven to be a pleasant addition.
I honestly can't think of a piece of audio equipment that I've owned that has suffered multiple failures. A/V receivers though are a glaring exception.
Most of my stuff has come with long warranties (Bryston,Classe') or a proven track record of reliability (Linn,Oppo, Panasonic).
The $hit list includes Samsung, Mazda, Onkyo, Denon to name a few.

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