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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 7:39 am 
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Never mind. Upon further testing my DFR Moto combo still falls well short of the sound quality of my FiiO X5. I have been at this a long time and should have known better than to jump the gun. It does stomp all over listening to the phone directly, however.

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Last edited by good sound on Wed Aug 31, 2016 10:21 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 10:14 am 
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That’s quite the write up.

Just to correct – the previous versions of the Dragonfly can be powered directly from a smartphone. I use the Dragonfly 1.2 and a Jitterbug (sometimes) with my Samsung S7.

Android 5.0 and up natively supports USB Audio Class 1. However, the supported bit depth is only 16 or 24bits with sampling rates of 48khz and lower. I recall reading somewhere that the iPhone is no different but that could have been with an older version.

The USB Audio Player Pro app overrides the native Android Audio class and installs its own propriety driver. This will allow up to 32-bit/384kHz plus DSD. The app is not as polished as some of the other media players (Poweramp as example) but it is in constant development and improving almost weekly. Outside the improved sound quality, earlier versions were awful to use! Well worth the $10. There is a trial version available on the developers website for anyone interested.
http://www.extreamsd.com/index.php/uapp-overview

The OTG cable is needed to allow the Android device to act as a host and should also allow you to connect your smartphone to almost any USB DAC and not just portable ones. Out of curiosity I’ve connected my S7 to a Teac UD-501 and tried a few DSD files I have on hand…sounds great but not really practical given the limited storage vs the size of DSD files.

Anyone with an Android device who is looking for portability I would highly recommend looking into pairing your phone/tablet with a Dragonfly. Awesome combination!


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 10:59 am 
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sthomas1049 wrote:
That’s quite the write up.

Just to correct – the previous versions of the Dragonfly can be powered directly from a smartphone. I use the Dragonfly 1.2 and a Jitterbug (sometimes) with my Samsung S7.

Android 5.0 and up natively supports USB Audio Class 1. However, the supported bit depth is only 16 or 24bits with sampling rates of 48khz and lower. I recall reading somewhere that the iPhone is no different but that could have been with an older version.

The USB Audio Player Pro app overrides the native Android Audio class and installs its own propriety driver. This will allow up to 32-bit/384kHz plus DSD. The app is not as polished as some of the other media players (Poweramp as example) but it is in constant development and improving almost weekly. Outside the improved sound quality, earlier versions were awful to use! Well worth the $10. There is a trial version available on the developers website for anyone interested.
http://www.extreamsd.com/index.php/uapp-overview

The OTG cable is needed to allow the Android device to act as a host and should also allow you to connect your smartphone to almost any USB DAC and not just portable ones. Out of curiosity I’ve connected my S7 to a Teac UD-501 and tried a few DSD files I have on hand…sounds great but not really practical given the limited storage vs the size of DSD files.

Anyone with an Android device who is looking for portability I would highly recommend looking into pairing your phone/tablet with a Dragonfly. Awesome combination!


Thank you for the info. As far as the usability of previous versions of Dragonfly and smartphones I was simply going from what I read on the Audio quest website.

While I agree that UAPP is not the most polished of software, personally I find the sound quality and ease of use it provides more than makes up for any lack of polish. While Poweramp is very comprehensive I found it to be unintuitive and overly complex . As you say however UAPP is under constant development and I'd always improving.

I will have to try connecting my Moto to the USB input on my BFP-105 via OTG if only for the novelty of it as I can't perceive of that particular configuration being of any long term value.

I would be interested in knowing if you have done any comparisons with your S7/ Dragonfly 1.2 combo and any of the current crop of hi-rez stand alone DAPs?

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 1:16 pm 
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Strange AudioQuest would state that earlier versions of the Dragonfly would not work with smartphones. I have had no issues with mine even with past, older smartphones. The UAPP app even has all versions of the Dragonfly within its supported/tested DAC list.

I gave up on DAP’s years ago for the convenience of a smartphone. Took a loss with sound quality but was no longer needing to carry 2 devices.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 3:16 pm 
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What about battery life? I would imagine running the dragonfly takes a fair amount of juice, and you can't charge while running audio output...?

Jason


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 14, 2016 3:25 pm 
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doctor_big wrote:
What about battery life? I would imagine running the dragonfly takes a fair amount of juice, and you can't charge while running audio output...?

Jason


It does of course increase battery drain. Most reports I have seen claim it is about five percent. I would say that this number correlates pretty much to my own experience so far with my own phone more or less. Other phones could be slightly less or more . It is a legitimate consideration. While the additional battery drain is not excessive it also is not negligible .

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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 1:48 am 
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good sound wrote:
It does of course increase battery drain. Most reports I have seen claim it is about five percent. I would say that this number correlates pretty much to my own experience so far with my own phone more or less. Other phones could be slightly less or more . It is a legitimate consideration. While the additional battery drain is not excessive it also is not negligible .


Is there a way to charge the phone at the same time as using the OTG cable? Maybe a USB hub?

Jason


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 3:14 am 
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doctor_big wrote:
good sound wrote:
It does of course increase battery drain. Most reports I have seen claim it is about five percent. I would say that this number correlates pretty much to my own experience so far with my own phone more or less. Other phones could be slightly less or more . It is a legitimate consideration. While the additional battery drain is not excessive it also is not negligible .


Is there a way to charge the phone at the same time as using the OTG cable? Maybe a USB hub?

Jason


Did some research and found that the OTG circuit is for supplying power to an external device, which means charging and OTG are mutually exclusive.

Jason


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 6:43 am 
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I'm in the iPhone camp but is also looking at this in the exact same situation, i.e. don't want to carry two players.

On iPhone the previous dragonfly went over the power limit so that a portable USB hub was required. Black and Red solved this problem.

As for charging I heard there's an Apple cable that allows a USB and extend a lighting port as well so that you can charge at the same time.

However I wonder if anyone has tried that in their car audio? My usage is mainly when I'm driving and currently using bluetooth seems pretty limiting to me. With either Red / Black I'll be using the aux input which supposed to be much direct and better. Anyone with similar experience please share.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 15, 2016 7:05 am 
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chuttt wrote:
I'm in the iPhone camp but is also looking at this in the exact same situation, i.e. don't want to carry two players.

On iPhone the previous dragonfly went over the power limit so that a portable USB hub was required. Black and Red solved this problem.

As for charging I heard there's an Apple cable that allows a USB and extend a lighting port as well so that you can charge at the same time.

However I wonder if anyone has tried that in their car audio? My usage is mainly when I'm driving and currently using bluetooth seems pretty limiting to me. With either Red / Black I'll be using the aux input which supposed to be much direct and better. Anyone with similar experience please share.

Arcam has a product for the iPhone
https://baybloorradio.com/arcam-musicbo ... ttery-pack


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 28, 2016 10:12 am 
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I took the Dragonfly Red home for evaluation on my mid level system (BAT VK-33, Bryston 14B Cubed, Martin Logan Renaissance 15A) while I loaned out my Chord Hugo TT. It was connected from my HTPC and Jitterbug to the preamp via 3.5mm to RCA. I was immediately impressed with the sound quality, it was perfectly acceptable. I was waiting for disappointment but it never really came. Overall it's a great product for the low price on a computer setup. I didn't have a chance to try it with a phone.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 11, 2016 6:47 am 
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Would the Dragonfly Red be a SIGNIFICANT & AUDIBLE improvement over my present Fiio E17 Alpen?

I'm playing 16/44 FLAC files (mostly blues) into either Senn HD 598, or (preferably) my B&W P5, Series 2 phones.

Thinking of replacing "the weakest link."......whatever that may be.

Cheers, del Sol


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PostPosted: Thu Apr 06, 2017 11:17 am 
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chuttt wrote:
I'm in the iPhone camp but is also looking at this in the exact same situation, i.e. don't want to carry two players.

On iPhone the previous dragonfly went over the power limit so that a portable USB hub was required. Black and Red solved this problem.

As for charging I heard there's an Apple cable that allows a USB and extend a lighting port as well so that you can charge at the same time.

However I wonder if anyone has tried that in their car audio? My usage is mainly when I'm driving and currently using bluetooth seems pretty limiting to me. With either Red / Black I'll be using the aux input which supposed to be much direct and better. Anyone with similar experience please share.


I recently picked up the Red and am going to be using it in my car audio system. I'll report once I install the longish rca cable and dial it in.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 8:54 am 
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I finally got the cable installed (from the line level converter in the trunk) so I can easily plug in the Dragonfly Red and employ my iphone's music. But maybe I should tell you why I wanted to do this first.

I've got a 2014 Altima with the non bose 6 speaker system. I thought it sounded alright until I replaced all the speakers with separates(in the front) and powered them with a Rockford Fosgate amp. I still use the stock head/nav unit by running its speaker outputs to a line level converter in the trunk, which feeds a crossover network and the amp. I also ran all new speaker wires. The new amp/speakers blew away the old system, but I would get occasional jitter which I suspected was from the digital to analog conversion in the nav unit. Hence my desire to do the DAC separately. (Edited to add: Occasional jitter when playing my iphone connected to the car Nav unit)

The line level converter has a set of stereo aux inputs, enter the dragonfly. I installed an RCA cable from the trunk, under the rear seats and carpet which comes up between the center console and passenger seat and is fixed there with a cable clip/screw. It of course needed a stereo rca(female) to stereo mini "Y" cable adaptor. The mini stereo connects into the Dragonfly, which with an iphone adaptor cable connects to the phone digitally.

As you might have noticed, I have two sources now. The /head/nav unit(with radio cd player, etc.) and the dragonfly. To toggle between them, the line level converter came with a volume module which allows you to toggle between main in and aux in by depressing the volume knob. I installed it under the steering wheel down low, and can toggle easily whenever I want.

So, on to the sound! I thought I had it pretty good after the amp/speaker install. Great sound without question, except for the occasional jitter. I am happy to say that the Red is better still. More detail, tighter bass and PRaT. Imaging is superior too, and no jitter issues. I also bought a blue tooth remote which allows hands free control(almost) of the music.

All in, I'm pretty impressed. The Dragonfly Red doesn't need a power supply, which is pretty neat. It runs off of the phone and doesn't seem like a big battery drain. If the battery does get low I'd simply toggle to the nav's inputs, then unplug the phone from the DAC and plug it into the Altima's USB, which of course will charge it. It would be a pretty long trip to run down the battery though.

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Last edited by runnin on Fri Apr 28, 2017 8:38 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Apr 09, 2017 12:00 pm 
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Highly recommended

https://www.wifihifi.ca/content/index/page?pid=4397


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