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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 5:58 am 
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The difference in conductivity is irrelevant. It is overwhelmed by the impedance of the speakers.

There is certainly greater absolute variance in speaker to speaker within the same model line than in the plating of the connector.


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:03 am 
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Don’t think conductivity is being debated here. The OP is looking for suggestions on what to use a 1000’ spool of 24AWG silver wiring.


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 6:59 am 
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Sorry, I should have referenced this quote:

warhorse wrote:
If you were going to the expense of pure silver jumpers why add rhodium into the mix? stick with the most highly conductive metals
Silver
Copper
gold

cheers


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 8:56 am 
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no disrespect intended bumpy
but i believe it does make a difference
It's like a very expensive high performance car and you go and put a set of bargain basement walmart tires on it.

My comment was intended to indicate that since he's using silver wire he should continue with a termination of equal conductivity.

and furthermore it's interesting that the tarnish on silver is equally conductive.

Cheers to all


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 9:36 am 
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sthomas1049 wrote:
It would require 15x 24 AWG wires to effectively achieve a 12 AWG jumper (assuming my math is correct)... you have yet to factor in your other materials and labor.


Your math is 100% correct.
I should be able to make 44 6" [for example] runs of 12 AWG, and everything would be insulated by hand [it's bare wire/rod].
I have factored in materials, and compared to what I would use for my [potential] speaker wire, the cost of terminations for these would be much lower given the smaller size barrel requirements. I'm not concerned with labour costs though [the price of 'The .1' is proof of that], I do all this stuff because I love doing it. :)
Also, I'm not too worried about flexibility. While the finished product wouldn't be the most flexible thing in the world, the softness of the wire makes it very easy to "train". Between that, and the fact that jumpers tend to be somewhat "permanent", flexibility shouldn't be an issue.
Thoughts?

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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 10:14 am 
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My 2¢: I can see such jumpers working well in any application where they don't get moved a lot. Such as between pre outs and main ins on an integrated amp or receiver. :D

nrg1275 wrote:
While the finished product wouldn't be the most flexible thing in the world, the softness of the wire makes it very easy to "train". Between that, and the fact that jumpers tend to be somewhat "permanent", flexibility shouldn't be an issue.


But if metal fatigue is a danger, maybe better not make them long, nor have them used by a person who swaps cables and speakers a lot. A heavy, stiff insulation layer would help in such a case.


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 11:55 am 
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Toby wrote:
My 2¢: I can see such jumpers working well in any application where they don't get moved a lot. Such as between pre outs and main ins on an integrated amp or receiver. :D

nrg1275 wrote:
While the finished product wouldn't be the most flexible thing in the world, the softness of the wire makes it very easy to "train". Between that, and the fact that jumpers tend to be somewhat "permanent", flexibility shouldn't be an issue.


But if metal fatigue is a danger, maybe better not make them long, nor have them used by a person who swaps cables and speakers a lot. A heavy, stiff insulation layer would help in such a case.


Very, very true. In fact, if it's easily fatigued, bend radius must be precisely calculated. #24 awg X8 = 16 awg.?

#24 awg. pure silver must be carefully handled. I'd suggest you use it as a premium USB (A-B) computer audio cable -perhaps a couple 3-5 ft. runs?

It may be too good (and fragile for?) bi-wire application, but I guess it depends on its final shape, sheathing/insulation and length.

pj


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:21 pm 
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warhorse wrote:
no disrespect intended bumpy
but i believe it does make a difference
It's like a very expensive high performance car and you go and put a set of bargain basement walmart tires on it.

My comment was intended to indicate that since he's using silver wire he should continue with a termination of equal conductivity.

and furthermore it's interesting that the tarnish on silver is equally conductive.

Cheers to all


Let`s calculate the Resistance of the plating on a connector like a Cardas spade. ( I used the dimensions from model CGMS R )

The resistivity (rho) of pure silver is 1.591E-08 per meter.

The resistivity (rho) of pure rhodium is 4.490E-08 per meter.

The area of contact of the spade is about 8.4E-05 square meters. This is Cross sectional Area of the conductor.

The thickness of the plating can be estimated at say 0.1 mm. or 1E-04m. This is length of conductor.

Resistance in ohms = rho * Length/cross sectional area

For silver this is 1.591E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 1.89405E-08

For Rhodium this is 4.490E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 5.34524E-08

Remember, E-08 means x 10 to the negative 8th power. Which means you shift the decimal place 8 places to the left.

So silver is 0.0000000189405 ohms, rhodium is 0.0000000534524 ohms.

Resistance of the coating does not matter. There is certainly greater variation in the components of the crossover and speaker.


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 12:51 pm 
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Bumpy wrote:
warhorse wrote:
no disrespect intended bumpy
but i believe it does make a difference
It's like a very expensive high performance car and you go and put a set of bargain basement walmart tires on it.

My comment was intended to indicate that since he's using silver wire he should continue with a termination of equal conductivity.

and furthermore it's interesting that the tarnish on silver is equally conductive.

Cheers to all


Let`s calculate the Resistance of the plating on a connector like a Cardas spade. ( I used the dimensions from model CGMS R )

The resistivity (rho) of pure silver is 1.591E-08 per meter.

The resistivity (rho) of pure rhodium is 4.490E-08 per meter.

The area of contact of the spade is about 8.4E-05 square meters. This is Cross sectional Area of the conductor.

The thickness of the plating can be estimated at say 0.1 mm. or 1E-04m. This is length of conductor.

Resistance in ohms = rho * Length/cross sectional area

For silver this is 1.591E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 1.89405E-08

For Rhodium this is 4.490E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 5.34524E-08

Remember, E-08 means x 10 to the negative 8th power. Which means you shift the decimal place 8 places to the left.

So silver is 0.0000000189405 ohms, rhodium is 0.0000000534524 ohms.

Resistance of the coating does not matter. There is certainly greater variation in the components of the crossover and speaker.



Woah, imagine doing those calculations on a slide-rule !

Warhorse: " ... and furthermore it's interesting that the tarnish on silver is equally conductive".

(Great point. Indeed, silver remains conductive as it oxidizes, yet I believe not as conductive as non oxygen-ized silver.).

pj


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:13 pm 
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Both Gold, and Rhodium are not the best conductors, yet they are used as a plating on connectors.

There is a very good reason, they do not tarnish, or corrode.

As for better sound???

Regards
Ohms

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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Fri Sep 22, 2017 4:29 pm 
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Bumpy wrote:
Let`s calculate the Resistance of the plating on a connector like a Cardas spade. ( I used the dimensions from model CGMS R )

The resistivity (rho) of pure silver is 1.591E-08 per meter.

The resistivity (rho) of pure rhodium is 4.490E-08 per meter.

The area of contact of the spade is about 8.4E-05 square meters. This is Cross sectional Area of the conductor.

The thickness of the plating can be estimated at say 0.1 mm. or 1E-04m. This is length of conductor.

Resistance in ohms = rho * Length/cross sectional area

For silver this is 1.591E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 1.89405E-08

For Rhodium this is 4.490E-08 * 1E-04/8.4E-05 = 5.34524E-08

Remember, E-08 means x 10 to the negative 8th power. Which means you shift the decimal place 8 places to the left.

So silver is 0.0000000189405 ohms, rhodium is 0.0000000534524 ohms.

Resistance of the coating does not matter. There is certainly greater variation in the components of the crossover and speaker.


:lol: ...Well done!


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:27 pm 
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AudiOhm wrote:
Both Gold, and Rhodium are not the best conductors, yet they are used as a plating on connectors.

There is a very good reason, they do not tarnish, or corrode.

As for better sound???

Regards
Ohms


Bingo.


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 2:47 pm 
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allhifi wrote:
#12 too much -#16 plenty capable -10-amps to be precise. In fact, offer up #18 gauge for this purpose with commensurate drop in price -and perhaps standard copper/gold connectors.

pj

I was thinking even 18ga was overkill. Depending on how the drivers are patched together, the 6" jumpers might never even see a fraction of that current.

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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Sun Sep 24, 2017 3:07 pm 
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pj[/quote]
I was thinking even 18ga was overkill. Depending on how the drivers are patched together, the 6" jumpers might never even see a fraction of that current.[/quote]

Yeah, you're all probably right.
I like
big gauges and cannot lie...

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Owner/Mad Scientist
NRG Custom Cables
Designed by Math & Science,
not marketing


"We use art to decorate space, we use music to decorate time"


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 Post subject: Re: Pure Silver Jumpers
PostPosted: Mon Sep 25, 2017 9:15 am 
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nrg1275 wrote:
pj wrote:
I was thinking even 18ga was overkill. Depending on how the drivers are patched together, the 6" jumpers might never even see a fraction of that current.


Yeah, you're all probably right.
I like
big gauges and cannot lie...


He is certainly right.

If the jumper is going to the tweeter, you're going to see *very* little current across it.

Through-hole parts inside crossovers, like resistors and capacitors, have very small gauge connections.

The big gauge satisfies a psychological, not electrical, "need".


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