Canuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio ForumCanuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio Forum
It is currently Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:25 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2
Author Message
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 9:43 am 
Offline
Dealer/Sponsor

Joined: Tue Jun 14, 2016 8:33 am
Posts: 1178
Location: Kingston, ON, CA
Uunderhill wrote:
Here is a good read on the topic.

https://ask.audio/articles/music-theory ... om-fiction

Again, during the Baroque period A was set to around 415 Hz.
Many instruments during this era were designed for this tuning.

In the never ending race to sound sweeter, solo violinists would tune slightly sharp from the orchestra.

Giusseppe Verdi is the only known composer who liked A = 432 Hz.

Then in 1939 A was set 440 Hz.


If there truly was something in harmonious in Nature about A = 432 Hz,
the Greeks, Western or other Cultures would have found it.



This is nice, but it is still surface analysis. Of the "deep enough for the average man to turn back into a comfortable dismissal- and never actually look".

Which is what makes it so dangerous to the idea of exploration. As it is not the consensus or overall masses that explore, but the individual. The masses cannot move and will not --if they can avoid it. The listed pdf explains the origins and motion in such... behaviors. In excruciating detail, no less; who-what-when-where-why-how, meanings, origins, how it fits together, all of it. Again, in hard scientific basis, if that is what it takes.

No matter the nature of your thoughts and posts, it becomes a yes man mirror of the average reader ...who uses it in a self inflicted 'nothing to see here-everyone go home and forget everything that was written and illustrated" regarding what was written just one post before.

Suddenly this complex subject gains a few words of dismissal, which become as the arbiter of it's facts and basis. It is a cunning yet dangerous bit of psychological play, where the new is expected to prove itself in the minds of others, 10x-20x over or more, even in the face of a plethora of facts.

Forums rarely solve anything and most frequently devolve into the lowest common denominator, where the psychological reflection of the animal (ego) in the given human rules the individual's interactions.

_________________
(Ken Hotte, of) Teo Audio


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 2:16 pm 
Offline

Joined: Wed Sep 14, 2005 11:47 am
Posts: 3833
Location: Ottawa, ON, CA
Teo Audio wrote:
This is nice, but it is still surface analysis. Of the "deep enough for the average man to turn back into a comfortable dismissal- and never actually look".


What I refer to as the Oprah Winfrey effect.
People who watch her show feel fully informed on the topic discussed.

Musical tuning and tuning of musical instruments is somewhat complex topic
and is mostly an art - but science certainly helps to understand it.

One thing that is critical to understand is that musicians and tuners
select strings, bows and drum heads and set the intonation to get the most out of the instrument.
Many Baroque instruments were designed for lower string tensions.

Teo Audio wrote:
That 440hz is apparently negative and destructive regarding the formation of neural firing patterns in the mind -- and that 432hz is apparently complimentary in it's resonances and complimentary neural pattern creation/aiding aspects.


Think you are underselling a 100's of years of Western Music
and 100,000's of musicians.
If there really was something to A 432 Hz, they would have picked up on it.

Also, if there was something to the scientific tuning of C = 256 Hz
There would have been a preference for that too.

However, there are 2 areas of music that are not fully understood.

The idea of consonance vs dissonance
Is this a cultural issue or related to the biology of the ear ?

The second is the argument concerning "Perfect Pitch"
However, I think much of what people refer to as perfect pitch is really pitch memory.
On a related topic, some people report to see colours when they hear a particular pitch.

One thing I should say - if a person has a great understanding of a complex topic
they can explain it in very simple terms (like my former High Tech employer)
.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 3:00 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Mar 25, 2016 12:47 pm
Posts: 120
Location: Leduc, AB, CA
We are constantly bombarded with information, it seems to me, mostly designed to direct our opinions and views of our world and to inculcate the young before they learn how to reason. Misinformation begins with leaving out important facts or downplaying their true importance. Those who use these tactics to gain prominence and power, at the end of the day, wish to deny us all a means to see through their smoke screens. For example, Steven Harper, with the inner circle, and the politics of entitlement that is the cornerstone of Conservative creed of putting the party, and its most dedicated supporters, to be given the plums of monetary potential, before the good of the country. The Japanese, who admittedly have taken the opportunity to vastly improve their society, exclude their actions during the Second World War from the history books of their educational curriculum. Likewise, the Catholic Church does not teach the students in their schools about the likes of the Spanish Inquisition and the murdering of those who would follow a different religion.

In the United States, 50 years ago, the wealthiest 1% owned 50% of the country's wealth; today they own 90%. This didn't happen by accident. The rich have funded politicians who would agree to put the good of the people second so that the rich could become richer and more powerful. Have you noticed how destitute Trump has left Porto Rico, claiming that lack of infrastructure makes it impossible to intervene. Of course, any amount of military helicopters could readily be deployed to impact-fully help. America TV networks never mention the recent flooding in Pakistan that displaced 40 million people when a month of rain fell in one day during the rainy season. And Trump insists that man has little to do with global warming! Too many powerful businesses make their money by using minimal cost methods that pollute, and the taxpayer is left with the cost and poor health. The connections are only too obvious. Yet almost half of the American population "bought" Trump's outrageous claims that he could make America great again! Reminds me of Dire Straits' "Something for Nothing".

I'm sure you all remember the claims that MP3 technology was just as good as CD's. There was all kinds of patting oneself on the back. It's too bad none of them had ever heard music compentently reproduced. Or, maybe they had, and were just out to make a buck. The general public is always ready to purchase a silk purse for the price of a sow's ear. And in the realms of music, that's all many really want, and that's their privilege. That's why people buy Mustangs instead of Porsches.

I'm not really sure of the intensions of the people who would "enlighten" us about 432Hz music, but I am surely gratified to see CAM'ers jumping all over this as someone again attempts to, I believe, pull the wool over our eyes again. Or, "Nothing is as dangerous as a little bit of knowledge".

As one of Baroque Music's biggest fans, I find it incredible that Columbia didn't use, for instance, Max Goberman's New York Sinfonietta as the group of choice to accompany the organ in the Boult/LPO project. Baroque music fell out of favour during the early part of the Twentieth Century because the evolution of modern instruments for playing modern music now only spanned the Classical Period to the Modern Period and left Ancient music behind. The revival of Baroque Music specifically was based upon the realization of conductors like Karl Richter, Nikolaus Harnoncourt, Gustav Leonhardt and Neville Marriner, whose Academy of Ancient Music, from England, would have been a better fit for the aforementioned Boult/LPO project, that Ancient Music was written to be played on ancient, read period, instruments. Mendelssohn had previously spearheaded a revival of Bach before modern instruments had changed too much and a true sense of the music could still be realized. I have a recording of Beethoven piano pieces played on a fortepiano, built by the same craftsman, two serial number different than the fortepiano Beethoven used to compose many of his works. To my ear, no modern piano does justice to his work as does the period instrument.

All over the world, modern interpretations of ancient music from most cultures have been offered to the public. And we can't forget "Switched-On Bach" played on a Moog Synthesizer; bringing Bach to the masses, as it were. So, should we discard the music of the past by re-inventing it on the whim of an uneducated opinion? Oh, isn't that neat? I think not. How many more times will we step backwards on a mis-guided attempt to blunder forward into the dark. IMHO, Bach is the greatest composer of all time, and because of the way musicians are trained today, no one will likely ever best him or the other giants of the past. Should we discard part of our history, as so many others have already done for their convenience? Or, should the truth and greatness of our world's heritage be preserved for all to celebrate forever. How many species became extinct today? Close to 100! Someone has to care and not just bury their heads in the sands of indifference! When is progress not progress and just another excuse to make money at our general expense? The majority of examples lie on the negative side, fuelled by indifference. Keep up the search for truth! Cheers!


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Mon Oct 02, 2017 6:01 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 28, 2016 3:50 pm
Posts: 5
Location: Halifax, NS, CA
I know virtually nothing about this topic, but thought you might be interested in the announcement of this new product coming out from Schiit Audio (Mike Moffat):

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/what-a- ... t-13721286


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 3:20 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:45 pm
Posts: 816
Location: Rockwood, ON, CA
rlowe wrote:
I know virtually nothing about this topic, but thought you might be interested in the announcement of this new product coming out from Schiit Audio (Mike Moffat):

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/what-a- ... t-13721286


For those of us with too much time on our hands, we can try a few retuned tracks. -2.171 % seems pretty close for retuning C4 in Audacity. You can do a whole album at once using chain (batch) processing.

Attachment:
Capture.JPG
Capture.JPG [ 118.98 KiB | Viewed 240 times ]

_________________
Decware SE84UFO2... Chord 2Qute... Omega SAM's... TEO GC Liquid Cables... Audiosector Integrated... Auralic Aries Femto... Sonore Microrendu... Equi-Core 1200 Power Conditioner... MCRU LPS... Audioquest Dragonfly Red... Zavfino1877 power cord.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 5:04 pm 
Offline

Joined: Sat Jan 06, 2007 7:38 pm
Posts: 1057
Location: woodbridge, ON, CA
why C4 just curious


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Tue Oct 03, 2017 9:20 pm 
Offline
Dealer/Sponsor
User avatar

Joined: Mon Sep 19, 2005 12:50 pm
Posts: 749
Location: New Westminster, BC, CA
I think you can probably put the whole thing down to bad drummers.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 5:01 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:37 am
Posts: 418
Location: Vaughan, ON, CA
milesian wrote:
rlowe wrote:
I know virtually nothing about this topic, but thought you might be interested in the announcement of this new product coming out from Schiit Audio (Mike Moffat):

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/what-a- ... t-13721286


For those of us with too much time on our hands, we can try a few retuned tracks. -2.171 % seems pretty close for retuning C4 in Audacity. You can do a whole album at once using chain (batch) processing.

Attachment:
Capture.JPG

Don't leave us in suspense... how does it sound to you?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 6:15 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:45 pm
Posts: 816
Location: Rockwood, ON, CA
pierre_b wrote:
milesian wrote:
rlowe wrote:
I know virtually nothing about this topic, but thought you might be interested in the announcement of this new product coming out from Schiit Audio (Mike Moffat):

https://www.head-fi.org/threads/what-a- ... t-13721286


For those of us with too much time on our hands, we can try a few retuned tracks. -2.171 % seems pretty close for retuning C4 in Audacity. You can do a whole album at once using chain (batch) processing.

Attachment:
Capture.JPG

Don't leave us in suspense... how does it sound to you?


Like a choir of seraphic angels.

_________________
Decware SE84UFO2... Chord 2Qute... Omega SAM's... TEO GC Liquid Cables... Audiosector Integrated... Auralic Aries Femto... Sonore Microrendu... Equi-Core 1200 Power Conditioner... MCRU LPS... Audioquest Dragonfly Red... Zavfino1877 power cord.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:16 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:37 am
Posts: 418
Location: Vaughan, ON, CA
^^^ "As a comedian, in all seriousness..." - and assuming that the guy from Schitt isn't pulling our legs - he did say that it sounds like "an electronic joint. Absolutely intoxicating. I cannot put it down. It alters your mood" so I'm wondering if you noticed a difference in, say, the lute tunes you know so well?

Old acoustic music should be just the thing that would benefit, or so "they" say...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 7:36 am 
Offline

Joined: Fri May 20, 2011 12:15 pm
Posts: 255
Location: toronto, ON, CA
The linked file cites C3. What gives?


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:11 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 3:45 pm
Posts: 816
Location: Rockwood, ON, CA
pierre_b wrote:
^^^ "As a comedian, in all seriousness..." - and assuming that the guy from Schitt isn't pulling our legs - he did say that it sounds like "an electronic joint. Absolutely intoxicating. I cannot put it down. It alters your mood" so I'm wondering if you noticed a difference in, say, the lute tunes you know so well?

Old acoustic music should be just the thing that would benefit, or so "they" say...


To be honest I haven't sat down with my good system yet to listen to any files converted to C256. I did a favorite Pete Alderton album (also declipping in the process) and thought it sounded excellent, on my casual listening system, but as to whether or not it sounded better I can't say on such a short audition. My feeling is that any subliminal effect from changing pitch is not something that would be noticed in AB testing. I don't like AB testing anyway, since the only way I can detect a change is to listen for a week to a new enhancement, and then go back to see if I still enjoy listening to the original. AB testing with a quick back and forth switch doesn't make sense to me, since my ears and auditory perceptions don't respond that quickly to sudden changes. Most of my Lute music listening is with Tidal, so obviously I can't change the pitch on streamed music. But I will make a list of my own classical guitar and lute wav files, and convert a few for the serious system for some long term listening. I did read a lot of guitar players tune their A string to 432 hz, and I have just done this on my own classical guitar. Again I haven't had chance to sit down and listen. Once the cooler evenings arrive and I spend less time outside, I'll start to evaluate. Another interesting experiment for any Tidal subscribers is to make a playlist of music in the Dorian mode. That too is said to have mood altering effects, although I find it a little too dark and melancholy for extended listening.

_________________
Decware SE84UFO2... Chord 2Qute... Omega SAM's... TEO GC Liquid Cables... Audiosector Integrated... Auralic Aries Femto... Sonore Microrendu... Equi-Core 1200 Power Conditioner... MCRU LPS... Audioquest Dragonfly Red... Zavfino1877 power cord.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
 Post subject: Re: 432 HZ Music
PostPosted: Wed Oct 04, 2017 11:47 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:37 am
Posts: 418
Location: Vaughan, ON, CA
milesian wrote:
pierre_b wrote:
^^^ "As a comedian, in all seriousness..." - and assuming that the guy from Schitt isn't pulling our legs - he did say that it sounds like "an electronic joint. Absolutely intoxicating. I cannot put it down. It alters your mood" so I'm wondering if you noticed a difference in, say, the lute tunes you know so well?

Old acoustic music should be just the thing that would benefit, or so "they" say...


To be honest I haven't sat down with my good system yet to listen to any files converted to C256. I did a favorite Pete Alderton album (also declipping in the process) and thought it sounded excellent, on my casual listening system, but as to whether or not it sounded better I can't say on such a short audition. My feeling is that any subliminal effect from changing pitch is not something that would be noticed in AB testing. I don't like AB testing anyway, since the only way I can detect a change is to listen for a week to a new enhancement, and then go back to see if I still enjoy listening to the original. AB testing with a quick back and forth switch doesn't make sense to me, since my ears and auditory perceptions don't respond that quickly to sudden changes. Most of my Lute music listening is with Tidal, so obviously I can't change the pitch on streamed music. But I will make a list of my own classical guitar and lute wav files, and convert a few for the serious system for some long term listening. I did read a lot of guitar players tune their A string to 432 hz, and I have just done this on my own classical guitar. Again I haven't had chance to sit down and listen. Once the cooler evenings arrive and I spend less time outside, I'll start to evaluate. Another interesting experiment for any Tidal subscribers is to make a playlist of music in the Dorian mode. That too is said to have mood altering effects, although I find it a little too dark and melancholy for extended listening.

Agree completely re: need for longer auditions of new sounds.
Thanks for tip re: Dorian, just looking into that now.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 28 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: brollo and 10 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group