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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 11:38 am 
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I tried to find an open thread on this but could not, so I started one.

System is Rega P2 > Sansui AU517 > Klipsch Heresy II's

Room is pretty much square with wall 13' wide by 14' long, so not the greatest acoustic room in the first place. One window facing lengthwise and a patio door, to the back left. Room opens with two regular size doors opening out. I have a large shag carpet on the floor. Speakers are about 1' off the floor in the corners facing directly the opposite corner.

I was thinking about buying some curtains to place over the patio doors and in the two back corners which the speakers are facing, thus it might eliminate some treble reflections. The Klipsch are very bright in this room, and even talking or shouting above normal speach levels produces an audible echo. The room is too bright.

Any comments?

Thanks


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 12:07 pm 
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Get some absorbtion in those opposite corners, for a start.

Cheers,
Alec


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 12:23 pm 
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treating for Hf issues will not affect the bass, but the shape of your room will cause bass issues.

Heavy curtains on the door will make an improvement, also adjust toe-in, and then address the first reflection points.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 12:33 pm 
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Try hanging some heavy velour 4'x2' curtains at various points along your walls until you find the spot where the highs are tamed the best. Don't worry - they're not going to stay there. But it will give you an idea where the best locations are to hang some nice-looking sound absorbing panels. I prefer DIY panels since that allows you to customize them to fit in with your existing decor.

How high is your ceiling? If it's 8' - 10', then you might want to experiment with panels up there as well.

Definitely hang curtains over the patio doors (the heavier, the better).

Have fun experimenting!

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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 3:03 pm 
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If you set the speakers up on the diagonal, you reduce the amplitude of sidewall reflections in small, near square rooms. This also reduces parallel standing wave behaviour. Once diagonal, treating all 4 corners will reduce late rectalinear reflections. This will reduce room decay, the real source of your issues, and allow you to back your listening position onto the corner opposing your new loudspeaker setup. You have now augmented the perceived bass response, and controlled treble energy. Win win. :cool:


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:01 pm 
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Serenity_now wrote:
If you set the speakers up on the diagonal, you reduce the amplitude of sidewall reflections in small, near square rooms. This also reduces parallel standing wave behaviour. Once diagonal, treating all 4 corners will reduce late rectalinear reflections. This will reduce room decay, the real source of your issues, and allow you to back your listening position onto the corner opposing your new loudspeaker setup. You have now augmented the perceived bass response, and controlled treble energy. Win win. :cool:



+1 you just got a well informed free consultation


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 5:27 pm 
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something, anything in corners, curtains or something over glass as possible.
as mentioned, speaker positioning is as critical as it is elusive. a few inches here or there, toe in, back/side wall space.
i have a wool hanging rug directly behind my listening chair.
manages the edgee without losing bass or high frequency, my experience suggests it improves both sonically.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 6:04 pm 
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I found those speakers particularly sharp in the treble too, so if the treatments don't deal with you issue it might be worth auditioning another pair...


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 7:59 pm 
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If the tweeters are hot (not temperature), here's a cheap experiment, that might help a lot: attach a 10 Ohm resistor across each tweeter.

Cheers,
Alec


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 18, 2016 8:29 pm 
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Cheapest (compared to similar products) and easiest to use, and wife friendly, are the Synergistic Research HFT devices. Pencil eraser sized metal concave pieces, that you stick to the wall with a dab of blue tack.

They really work amazingly well. What is neat, is that you can move one of the up and down a side wall, and hear rhe effect on the high feequencies. They really tMe the high frequency hash and sibilance so well.

I find they work best in a small room such as your 13x14 ft room, where hard surfaces, windows, blinds etc create havoc.

Buy just one set to start. I bought my 2 sets when they first came out, and when they were much cheaper then. Rheir popularity has driven the price up. Buy some on CAM, I see they come up once in a while, usually from someone who bought too many. This is one tweak you will never sell once you hear them work. I don't know the exact science, but generally since high frequencies beam all over the room bouncing off hard surfaces, you move them about until you find the bad spots. I was so skeptical, but my dealer let me try them with no obligation. They worked so well I bought 2 sets, one for each of my 2 hi fi systems. They worked so well, if I listened to my main system, I would steal the set from my backup system and put them on the spots I had marked. Takes 5 minutes to move them from one room to the next, so this worked better than buying 2 more sets.

I also have an expensive $1500 pair of large 5 ft x 2 ft bass traps, that while more expensive by leaps, are not as effective as the HFT are at what they do. Yes, you can find a sweet spot too, where sibilance and harshness is reduced without killing your bass.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 1:28 pm 
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The vast majority of room treatments meant to help control treble will do nothing to "harm" your bass.

It takes mass to absorb bass, so the typical 1-3 inch panel right on a wall won't change the bass response in a room, but can help with absorbing first reflection points.

I have a couple of panels in my basement now (3 inch thick hung 2 inches off the wall) and a few bass traps in the corners (3).

Interestingly, it seems that there is more bass not less after trapping. Bass traps seem to improve the quality of bass vs simply removing some. Odd as I had not expected that.

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 3:55 pm 
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Jared Rachwalski wrote:
treating for Hf issues will not affect the bass, but the shape of your room will cause bass issues.

Heavy curtains on the door will make an improvement, also adjust toe-in, and then address the first reflection points.



X 2 - He Nailed It

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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 7:30 pm 
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kawihornet wrote:
Jared Rachwalski wrote:
treating for Hf issues will not affect the bass, but the shape of your room will cause bass issues.

Heavy curtains on the door will make an improvement, also adjust toe-in, and then address the first reflection points.



X 2 - He Nailed It


Thanks for your input guys, I'm also wondering if these speakers might do better on the floor tilted up, but a bit closer together, to be able to adjust toe-in. Might improve soundstage. Right now they are direct diagonal firing into the opposite corners. I'll invest in some curtains and send a note to let you know how it sounds. Heresy's are superb in their clarity but are very finniky as far as overall sound.


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PostPosted: Mon Sep 19, 2016 8:32 pm 
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Again, treat those corners. That right-angle will fire the treble right back at you.

Cheers,
Alec


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