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Got Room Treatment?
Do you have a dedicated listening room? 35%  35%  [ 98 ]
Do you have room treatments in the listening area? 33%  33%  [ 91 ]
Do you plan on treating your listening area or adding more room treatments within the next year? 22%  22%  [ 61 ]
Did you use software to measure the room for acoustic flatness? 11%  11%  [ 30 ]
Total votes : 280
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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 6:11 pm 
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Location: Charlottetown, PE, CA
The ploy diffusers are simply 1/8" plywood veneers flexed between vertical runners screwed to the wall. The distance the runners are mounted needs to be 3% less than the width of the panel lying flat. I found the plans at gearslutz some time ago. Here ya go. :) At one point my room plan included a ceiling cloud, but my money focus was on the lateral plane. I had to prioritise my budget and the cloud wasn't deemed as critical as other areas at the time. I will see after the rear wall is done.

https://www.gearslutz.com/board/attachm ... panels.pdf


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 6:46 pm 
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Location: St.Catharines, ON, CA
Ok, big thanks for that, looks like a fairly easy build :D.Some of the DIY Qrd diffusers look very labour intensive.Where did you get your N23 Qrd diffusers?

Strange but I don't even lust after gear any more.Only interested in how good I can get my room and just reinforces how good my equipment really is.Sound treatments have made my digital playback sound like the turntable I wish I could own :lol:.A Massive move to a more natural sound 8).


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 6:55 pm 
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Joined: Mon Nov 29, 2004 6:37 am
Posts: 968
Location: East Toronto, ON, CA
kwadzilla wrote:
polygon wrote:
... and NO WIFE :lol: !


The #1 requirement for high fidelity.


:lol: :lol:


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 7:18 pm 
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Joined: Tue Jun 06, 2006 11:37 am
Posts: 519
Location: Ancaster, ON, CA
A dedicated listening room mitigates Wife Appreciation Factor (WAF) by a huge margin. I do what I want (it looks like this, etc) because it is my 'man cave.''


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 4:14 am 
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Location: Charlottetown, PE, CA
Itsnotluck wrote:
Ok, big thanks for that, looks like a fairly easy build :D.Some of the DIY Qrd diffusers look very labour intensive.Where did you get your N23 Qrd diffusers?

Strange but I don't even lust after gear any more.Only interested in how good I can get my room and just reinforces how good my equipment really is.Sound treatments have made my digital playback sound like the turntable I wish I could own :lol:.A Massive move to a more natural sound 8).



The N23 Battleship QRD was a DIY project designed with the free QRDude software. It was probably the most dramatic\sudden change in the soundfield. I would not recommend poly's for much more than flutter echo mitigation, as was their intent in my room.

I totally hear you about the "awakening" caused by going down the path of acoustics. I don't even bother getting involved in any online dustups with people who think otherwise. I save special shrugs for those like Edited by Mods . If they don't know, they don't know. ;)

Helping those who want to know, and learning with them, then getting the "holy F amazing" response, is all I need.

During the assembly process before paint.
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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 7:35 am 
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Location: Lasalle, ON, CA
+2

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Phil


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:16 am 
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Location: East Toronto, ON, CA
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.


That's me, everyone else is of course can do what they think would be right for them.


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:34 am 
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Location: GTA, ON, CA
naimkid wrote:
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.


That's me, everyone else is of course can do what they think would be right for them.


A properly treated room will make auditioning equipment much more easier. Downstream equipment cannot compensate for peaks and nulls created by poor acoustics. If you beleive is proper speaker set up, then proper acoustic treatment is no different.


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:41 am 
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Location: East Toronto, ON, CA
brf wrote:
naimkid wrote:
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.


That's me, everyone else is of course can do what they think would be right for them.


A properly treated room will make auditioning equipment much more easier. Downstream equipment cannot compensate for peaks and nulls created by poor acoustics. If you beleive is proper speaker set up, then proper acoustic treatment is no different.


I am not sure I am convinced.


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 8:51 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
naimkid wrote:
brf wrote:
naimkid wrote:
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.


That's me, everyone else is of course can do what they think would be right for them.


A properly treated room will make auditioning equipment much more easier. Downstream equipment cannot compensate for peaks and nulls created by poor acoustics. If you beleive is proper speaker set up, then proper acoustic treatment is no different.


I am not sure I am convinced.


Even the simplest of demonstrations shows the effects of room treatment. Going from a budget component(s) to something that is uber high-end will never accomplish the same.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cp56A6TcL1E


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 9:07 am 
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Location: 53˚27'46"N 2˚17'28"W
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Anyone who doesn't think room treatment is the biggest upgrade possible (if you don't already have it) is ... throwing their money away by upgrading gear.

If you take away 'the attack', is it really such a disagreeable statement?

naimkid wrote:
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.

Most equipments will measure reasonably flat, won't it? Take most DAC's, they measure really well; for instance the TEAC UD-503 is has a frequency response of 5Hz to 80kHz, +1dB/–3dB. The W4S mAMP is spec'd from 20Hz to 20kHz +/-0.1db, and the Paradigm S8 is measured at +/-2dB from 39Hz to 45KHz (assuming anechoic?). Yet, take a frequency sweep of a typically-sized and untreated room with these components and you wouldn't be surprised if there were 12-18dB peaks AND dips in the bass region, and perhaps a slightly or severely rising treble response.

You just don't know the sound of the room until you take away the sound of the room.

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"What you talking 'bout, Willis?."


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 9:09 am 
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Location: Newmarket, ON, CA
I've been in rooms that are extensively treated, including dedicated rooms with $80K speakers, more in the electronics. Makes perfect sense because sans panels there wasn't much else in there. Talked to the owners, of course he had been through multiple generations of treatments by them.

Good experiences and knowledgeable people .... great systems!! I'll take what I learned over 'awakenings' and the amazonian objective warrioress. :mrgreen:

... anyway, still say that modern designs, those 80K speakers included, are responsible for more than half the problem. :wink:

ps ... I had loads of room problems ... I noticed when I switched to 15" Tannoy (1979/80 vintage) ... then all the room problems went away ... a real awakening :shock:


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 9:36 am 
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Location: East Toronto, ON, CA
If I am not enjoying music and continue to think about SQ, then there must be a fundamental flaw in my system, that I need to find and eliminate that first.


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 9:41 am 
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Location: St.Catharines, ON, CA
naimkid wrote:
brf wrote:
naimkid wrote:
How would you know that it's the room treatment one needs to focus on and not the equipment upgrade?

I would spend my money on upgrading equipments instead of pillows, egg cartons and acoustic panels.


That's me, everyone else is of course can do what they think would be right for them.


A properly treated room will make auditioning equipment much more easier. Downstream equipment cannot compensate for peaks and nulls created by poor acoustics. If you beleive is proper speaker set up, then proper acoustic treatment is no different.


I am not sure I am convinced.


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=D66v5JC0eVk


Naim take the time to watch this video its been posted here a few times over the last few weeks.Hopefully you can hear the profound difference through your computer speaks.You will also be able to see the actual measurements of the before and after examples.You don't even need to go as extensive as this example to reap the benefits,I'm only at 8 panels at the moment.This is not your (I think I might possibly hear a difference but then again I'm not sure) moment, it has been "the revelation".


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 Post subject: Re: Room Treatment Poll
PostPosted: Sat Mar 26, 2016 10:48 am 
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Posts: 1149
Location: Markham, ON, CA
I clicked all 4. But granted the last one it's more about Home Theatre EQ... Anthem ARC is so good. In general I find the very flat response not the most attractive for me.

But for everything else, from my real life experience, is that a well treated room and a dedicated power is the two most important things to accomplish consistently good sound. (note my definition of room treatment includes proper positioning of speakers wrt to the treatment.)

What I found is that once I have these right my room is now quiet (and my energy source is consistent) that I can really start to evaluate the equipment.. and by that time the selection of equipment is more to preference/taste than good/bad.


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