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 Post subject: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 5:36 am 
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Joined: Tue Nov 14, 2006 12:27 pm
Posts: 706
Location: ottawa, ON, CA
Ok, I have my new B&W 800 diamonds and am now looking at one of the final steps to get the best sound which of course is actually treating the room. The bass sounds tight and is quite good but they sound a little closed in( 8 foot suspended so I guess I am looking at diffusion. I want something that works well,looks good and isn't to ridiculous on the wallet.Any suggestions? I am also not adverse to DIY stuff...thanks for any and all input....


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 6:18 am 
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Joined: Sun Jan 16, 2005 8:59 am
Posts: 2769
Location: Dundas, ON, CA
Though I've personally found diffusion effective to address some very specific issues with my room, research from a few different acousticians, some of which have their own Acoustic treatment companies (RPG), suggests that there is a minimum effective listening distance for diffuser style room treatments. If you pore through enough Studiotips.com threads on this subject, you'll find this subject discussed at some length by some very learned professional contributors. So for smaller rooms, selective absorption is all that is usually recommended as often in these smaller listening spaces the minimum distance of multiple wavelengths from the diffusive element (typically a Polycylindrical or Schroeder style design) can't be achieved. To-date, the CAM Room Acoustics sub-forum ain't all that large but there are are a few meaty DIY threads found within it. Amongst them are my two DIY build threads for diffusers. I provided lots of links to my source material. Have at 'er.

Happy Trails!
MTB Vince

***Moderation note: BTW I moved your post from the "General Audio Discussion" forum into the "Room Acoustics and Treatments" sub-forum specific to the subject being asked about.

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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 7:19 am 
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Location: ottawa, ON, CA
My room is approx 14.5 feet wide, 19.5 feet long with 8 foot ceiling. Could you be a little more specific in how you would treat it? I am looking to make it sound more spacious( if possible).


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 8:33 am 
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Joined: Fri Dec 01, 2006 2:44 pm
Posts: 354
Location: Toronto
My room is slightly smaller than yours. The sound benefitted immensely when I installed Real Traps bass traps in the corners as well as some of their other panels. If you're looking for a fuller sound, this will help.

Real Traps are almost industrial in build quality and quite expensive when delivery is factored in. I'm pretty sure you could get most of the benefits going DIY. There is another company named GIK that offers a finished product that is far less costly than Real Traps. Just a bit more fragile than Real Traps.


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:12 am 
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Joined: Wed Sep 13, 2006 7:45 pm
Posts: 549
Location: Athabasca, AB, CA
Ethan(Realtraps),Glenn(Gik)say you can't have enough bass traps.
floor to ceiling corners,first reflections for your main speakers(side walls) and behind your mains also.
Even, I believe about midway (ceiling) between you and your speakers.
You can E-mail these guys and tell them what you have for a room.
For sure Bass traps and first reflections and go from there.
Both sites show you some room lay outs and they also have different room diagrams that show you
where and how.
I bought my first (Gik)traps last year,I first wanted Realtraps but way more expensive about 2/3 more.
I was using one sub with my TT as with two if I turned her up I'd get feedback thru the 2 subs.
After installing the(tritraps) basstraps,totally shocked at the improvement.Now I use two subs(no feedback)
and I can turn her up :D .Bottomend is way tighter and focused.
I'd check their sites and go from there,but definately bass trapping and first reflections to start as far
as acoustical treatment.
PS:My room was not even close to being ready for treatment as the walls were all paneling(no insulation)on inside walls
or doubling of drwall ect,yet alone the ceiling.
For my not so ideal room the traps made a major improvement,hope that helps you out.


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Mon Nov 15, 2010 9:44 am 
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Joined: Fri Sep 23, 2005 5:54 am
Posts: 1737
Location: Gatineau, QC, CA
Alex65,
I have just finished, well....ongoing, my treatment in a room almost the same size as yours. I did mostly bass trapping, front and back absorption, and a ceiling absorber as well. I'd be happy to show you my room and explain the reasoning and construction methods, it was pretty cheap....equivalent treatment with a commercial product will cost you $3-4000. PM me if you are interested in hearing, seeing, whatever...I'm in gatineau.

-- 15 Nov 2010 17:55 --

Just a note on what to expect sound wise.

- First...your room will be much more dead sounding.
- Bass will become really punchy and really detailed, easy to follow bass content...
- "Spacious"....Hmmmm, yeah...what you end up with is a much more true and accurate representation of the space the music was recorded in, the low level details that define the reverb trails will be there without the smearing caused by the room reflections.
- The balance in your room will be very iniform, walk around the room and hear the same basic balance everywhere, sit in the sweet spot and your world will snap into focus.
- You may find that listening at very low levels makes things sound far away, this is because you no longer have a "wash" of sound, and the fact that you are no longer hearing "your room" as much means you need to put the volume high enough for the space in the "recorded" room to fool your brain into putting you there as opposed to a really dead sounding room, erase the room is the name of the game. When the volume is right the image is massive, the stage defies boundaries....details are like never before.


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 3:12 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:29 pm
Posts: 664
Location: SW, ON, CA
I came across this page today while surfing the web. Interesting and relevant I thought. The band Foo Fighters have this guide to acoustic treatments on their webpage. How insightful. FYI

http://foofighters.com/soundproofing

cheers,

Paul

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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 4:51 am 
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Joined: Sat Jan 23, 2016 3:47 pm
Posts: 1219
Location: Oakville, ON, CA
pollypocket wrote:
I came across this page today while surfing the web. Interesting and relevant I thought. The band Foo Fighters have this guide to acoustic treatments on their webpage. How insightful. FYI

http://foofighters.com/soundproofing

cheers,

Paul


That Foo Fighters URL links to a 500 page textbook!

http://bit.ly/1Rw4MTA

If answers to your questions aren't in there, well...there probably isn't an answer.


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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Fri Mar 25, 2016 5:02 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 21, 2005 12:29 pm
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Location: SW, ON, CA
I think most would consider that book as the bible of acoustics for audio.


Paul

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 Post subject: Re: acoustic treatment
PostPosted: Wed Mar 30, 2016 10:27 am 
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Joined: Sun Aug 17, 2014 8:11 am
Posts: 73
Location: Rose dale, BC, CA
All my acoustic treating is home made,studied net for most information and shopped at Home Depot.most is strait foreword common sense,bass trapping all corners floor to ceiling with cement cardboard tubes stuffed with roxul,wood base and wrapped with what ever you want,"moving blankets work well and are cheap,also use them to hide absorbers hung on walls".Framed roxul 6inch thick or more for first reflections side walls always and ceiling clouds as you progress.Diffusion for front and rear walls,quadratic and skyline type,many design to choose from and looks cool.Most is trial and error,but I have never had to remove any,always made improvement.If your room is small,all the more important,try listening in the near field,that's what I do,takes the room way even more,try the 38% rule,listening chair 38% from front or rear wall,which is more practical for room layout.near field listening will put you front row centre with detail and clarity you never heard before.Near field will most likely become the way you listen for ever and ever! After acoustics are resolved let the tweaking begin! a whole new music experience is about to begin that will keep you tube rolling and vinyl spinning for the rest of your life! " but remember,NO DIGITAL!"


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