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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 6:53 am 
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About $500 -$600 when I purchased a QNAP TS-112 with a 2TB drive, running Twonky about 6 years ago. Over the last few years, MinimServer replaced Twonky as the music server software of choice and it has been completely trouble free. I've had a good experience with QNAP and just purchased a 2-bay QNAP enclosure from a CAM member last week. This will replace my single bay TS-112 and allow for additional storage. One thing that you also need to factor in are the costs of one (or two) external drives for backup. In my case, I am using a 2.5" WD 3TB drives to backup from the NAS to the drives. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to make incremental backups every month and keep one backup offsite.

For my needs, using a NAS offers a simpler approach as I use a network streamer. When required, I mount the NAS drive on my laptop, drag and drop the new files/folders, run a rescan for MinimServer, backup to an external drive which I connect to my laptop via USB and its done. It does not require an additional computer in the mix and no audio software.


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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:22 am 
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buzzinghive wrote:
Other than the RFI/EMi which I addressed previously I don't know what else would be of significance esp given that you are converting the signal back to spdif with a well respected device and then reclocking it in a rather high spec. dac . The power supply for the laptop is designed for its specific application. I would not screw with it personally


There's a quick way to test that. The laptop has a battery. Just unplug the power supply and let it run on battery power. You can even do an A/B/ comparison and listen for noise... plug in, plug out.

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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 9:59 am 
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Location: Victoria, BC, CA
I suppose all things being equal if you run a laptop on battery and listen on headphones for "digital" noise as opposed to the ambient noise differential caused by different power schemes when plugged in or on battery such as CPU throttling, fan settings etc.


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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 11:32 am 
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Laptop with your music on it - under $500. Or an Auralic streamer with any NAS drive - under $1000. Unless you're a computer genius and love tweaking, don't build a server. They require software maintenance which is far beyond your typical audio consumer.

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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 2:35 pm 
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Location: Saskatoon, SK, CA
Ants wrote:
About $500 -$600 when I purchased a QNAP TS-112 with a 2TB drive, running Twonky about 6 years ago. Over the last few years, MinimServer replaced Twonky as the music server software of choice and it has been completely trouble free. I've had a good experience with QNAP and just purchased a 2-bay QNAP enclosure from a CAM member last week. This will replace my single bay TS-112 and allow for additional storage. One thing that you also need to factor in are the costs of one (or two) external drives for backup. In my case, I am using a 2.5" WD 3TB drives to backup from the NAS to the drives. I use Carbon Copy Cloner to make incremental backups every month and keep one backup offsite.

For my needs, using a NAS offers a simpler approach as I use a network streamer. When required, I mount the NAS drive on my laptop, drag and drop the new files/folders, run a rescan for MinimServer, backup to an external drive which I connect to my laptop via USB and its done. It does not require an additional computer in the mix and no audio software.


MinimServer sounds pretty cool, and it looks like you can use BubbleUPnP to control it remotely; do you know of an equivalent way to control MS via iOS?

Currently liking Emby, but its iOS app hasn't worked for me yet, which is not a good sign. If it weren't that my iOS phone is free, I would have different requirements.


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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 2:49 pm 
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Location: Montreal, QC, CA
ToddSecksington wrote:
MinimServer sounds pretty cool, and it looks like you can use BubbleUPnP to control it remotely; do you know of an equivalent way to control MS via iOS?

Currently liking Emby, but its iOS app hasn't worked for me yet, which is not a good sign. If it weren't that my iOS phone is free, I would have different requirements.


As far as I know MinimServer is compatible with a host of control points (aka "apps/music browser software"). You can see the current list at http://minimserver.com/ug-browsing.html ... l%20points

I was using BubbleUPnP in conjunction with MinimServer with control points from Linn and Lumin to control a Moon Mind streamer. Bubble allows you to create an OpenHome Media Renderer which in turn allowed me to use other apps to manage the music library/streamer.

I currently use the Naim app (as I have a Naim streamer) on my iPad/iPhone and run MinimServer on the NAS.

Hope this helps.


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PostPosted: Mon May 15, 2017 3:57 pm 
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Ants wrote:
ToddSecksington wrote:
MinimServer sounds pretty cool, and it looks like you can use BubbleUPnP to control it remotely; do you know of an equivalent way to control MS via iOS?

Currently liking Emby, but its iOS app hasn't worked for me yet, which is not a good sign. If it weren't that my iOS phone is free, I would have different requirements.


As far as I know MinimServer is compatible with a host of control points (aka "apps/music browser software"). You can see the current list at http://minimserver.com/ug-browsing.html ... l%20points

I was using BubbleUPnP in conjunction with MinimServer with control points from Linn and Lumin to control a Moon Mind streamer. Bubble allows you to create an OpenHome Media Renderer which in turn allowed me to use other apps to manage the music library/streamer.

I currently use the Naim app (as I have a Naim streamer) on my iPad/iPhone and run MinimServer on the NAS.

Hope this helps.


I have been digging around and have not yet found an app that I can put on iOS that will let me play from an external network. Unless I am missing something. Bubble seems to cover android clients.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:55 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
To put all options on the table you might also look at renderers ie. mind180 that can interact with your computer/nas or aurrender/ Cambridge / meridian- any number of other music servers which seem to take computer out of it.

I have a mind180 which i bought as i liked the interface- ie. i can control on my ipad - access nas - something i did not see as an option running from a computer (perhaps something available i don't know about) - still requires a computer in the chain though and a bit of third party code - can connect via ethernet or wirelessly.

I have two very computer savvy friends who bought aurrenders (one quite recently) - one really likes and recommends - the other just picked up on the weekend (so no feedback yet). The one friend likes for the sonic benefits - but not inexpensive for what he bought.

Unless you have an extra computer i would look at one of these as an option provided it can work with a nas or some other external storage. I like the additional functionality offered (ie. the nice remote/interface) and potential sonic benefits - plus relative simplicity. Doesn't hurt to look.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 3:13 am 
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ToddSecksington wrote:
I have been digging around and have not yet found an app that I can put on iOS that will let me play from an external network. Unless I am missing something. Bubble seems to cover android clients.


So, you wish to access your content from outside of your internal/home network? I think it requires some port forwarding setup on your router. I know QNAP have a app that allows this and I am pretty sure other manufactures such as Seagate and Synology offer a similar solution. Here's the QNAP info - https://www.qnap.com/en/how-to/tutorial ... ud-service. I think you can also install Plex on your NAS or your computer and use their iOS app to access your media from outside your internal network.

BubbleUPnP Server provides added functionally to an existing UPnP setup. In my case, I wanted to try different control points from other manufactures, so I added this app on my NAS to create an OpenHome network. Bubble UPnP runs in conjunction with MinimServer. You can read all about it at http://www.bubblesoftapps.com/bubbleupn ... pnp_server


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 3:26 am 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
planetofsound wrote:
Laptop with your music on it - under $500. Or an Auralic streamer with any NAS drive - under $1000. Unless you're a computer genius and love tweaking, don't build a server. They require software maintenance which is far beyond your typical audio consumer.


Hardly. A Raspberry Pi with Max2play software running LMS is extremely easy to set up and rugged as heck. <$100 and you're done, with bit-perfect audio and a hella good interface.

Jason


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:24 am 
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I have seen a few mentions of minim and bubble, and various rPi rigs. Ideally I just want to run one app on qnap.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 9:54 am 
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buzzinghive wrote:
I suppose all things being equal if you run a laptop on battery and listen on headphones for "digital" noise as opposed to the ambient noise differential caused by different power schemes when plugged in or on battery such as CPU throttling, fan settings etc.


I'm lucky, buzzinghive, I have one of the new fanless (convection liquid cooled) laptops. It's got a solid state hard drive, so no spin noise either. It's basically completely silent:
https://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/s ... tchalpha12

About $700 on sale at Staples.ca with 8GB of RAM and 128GB storage. For about $100 you can add a 200GB microSD card for more storage.

Perhaps a lot for a "music server" but you also get the latest generation corei5 computing power and a laptop you can use on a plane for 4 hours without recharging. :wink:

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At my desk right now: Kavent CD-731, Gallo Stradas, Gallo TR3D Sub, Raysonic SE-30A mk II (winter amp), ShengYa AS90 (summer amp), Dragonfly DAC2


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 11:23 am 
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ToddSecksington wrote:
I have seen a few mentions of minim and bubble, and various rPi rigs. Ideally I just want to run one app on qnap.

The server (QNAP) runs the app (either Minimserver or Bubble UPNP) which serves the audio to a renderer (RPI, Moon Mind, Bryston BPD, Auralic, etc).

Do you want to send audio directly from your QNAP to a dac?


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 1:20 pm 
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David_big_ears wrote:
I'm lucky, buzzinghive, I have one of the new fanless (convection liquid cooled) laptops. It's got a solid state hard drive, so no spin noise either. It's basically completely silent:
https://www.acer.com/ac/en/US/content/s ... tchalpha12

About $700 on sale at Staples.ca with 8GB of RAM and 128GB storage. For about $100 you can add a 200GB microSD card for more storage.

Perhaps a lot for a "music server" but you also get the latest generation corei5 computing power and a laptop you can use on a plane for 4 hours without recharging. :wink:


The Acer is a nice little laptop with a pretty ingenious way of dissipating heat through the aluminum back (which is thermally connected to the heat pipe inside). The CPU will throttle down if under load for too long but that should never be an issue if it is being used for audio playback. Just be carful not to dent the back – any damage to that heat pipe will affect its thermal performance.

As cool (no pun) as that Acer is, computer fans do not need to be audible to be effective. My rig below has a total of 10 fans, 2 for the front radiator, 3 for exhaust (rear and top), 1 for the PSU (behind the motherboard) and 4 for the 2 GPU’s. It is configured so that under a light load, such as audio playback, only the 2 radiator fans and 1 exhaust are operational at their lowest RPM. Sitting 6 feet away this is not audible at all. It is not until the computer become heavily taxed do the other fans begin to kick in. Even under extreme stress tests such as AIDA64 the computer is barley audible which demonstrates how efficient it’s cooling is. The larger the fan, the higher the CFM which means you can run them at a lower RPM for quieter performance.

I do not recommend a high-end build such as this for audio playback – it would be wasted. Just demonstrating that a silent computer can also be one with some horsepower behind it. Although mine was purpose built for audio playback, it does perform many other taxing duties. Low latency is more important for audio than computing power.


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PostPosted: Tue May 16, 2017 6:30 pm 
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For music playback only there is not really a need for a high end PC build or a high end Apple Mac - the CPU performance requirement is pretty low even for high-res 24/196 and there is no need for high end video card(s). I would say anything under $1K. Optimizing how the OS and its services behave is more important than raw power. I have a MacMini as the music server and it is good enough for playing high-res. music files and Tidal streaming using Audirvana Plus. This is connect to the DAC/SACD player via an USB cable and has an external Western Digital 1TB Firewire hard disk to store my musics. I remote control Audirvana by using the an app on my iPad or iPhone so I don't even need a monitor and a mouse.


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