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PostPosted: Sat Jul 22, 2017 2:43 pm 
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Location: Ajax, ON, CA
Hello CAM users,

I'd like to "pick your brains" about this RCM. Supposedly, it's manufactured by the "Nitty Gritty" folks, but possibly not the newer units. Here's an image of it:

Image

And a link to a UK supplier:
Code:
http://snvinyl.co.uk/Record-Doctor-V-RCMRecord-Cleaning-Machine


I'd like to hear some opinions on this unit, how does it compare to the "fully automatic" RCM units, etc. On a side note, I can't find a dealer/distributor here in Canada. And, the US dealers/shops refuse to ship tne unit, outside the United States.

What do you guys think about, running a 230V/50Hz unit, here on our 120V/60Hz supply. I realize the motor would run "a bit faster", but it's probably under a 1000 watts (the specs on the Pro-Ject VC-S RCM, show it has an 800 watt motor). Those UK guys, seem to frown on the idea of running the 230V unit in North America. Anyways, they don't seem too keen on "exporting" their UK spec unit to North America. Thanks, for reading and replying.

Regards,
Francis007


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 8:05 am 
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The first thing it needs is nitty-gritty brush material/pads around the vacuum intake. The behaviour and character of the fibers on the original brush material is terrible for trying to clean records. IMO and IME. When I use the hardware, brand new in this case... and get what seems like 'zero net effect', that's a big problem. Disclosure: I've used and owned the nitty-gritty 1.0, 1.5, and owned a vpi 16.5, all basically new and in perfect shape.

The original fiber material on that brush is too soft, too long and also sits to one side, so you can only clean in one direction. If you can get it to clean. The hand brush also needs to be different than what it is, it does not dig into the grooves. I'd think the problem is with both the hand brush and the brush around the vacuum slot. The combination has mildly but noticeably kneecapped the unit, from the get go.

Fix both those issues and it becomes a stellar machine for the money. The price might creep up by a few dollars but I'd like to not buy it in kit form where one has to fix the flaws so it works as well as is intended. It's still a great machine for the money but those two shortcomings, as a pair, are not what I'd like to see.

People buy the unit and some purchase upgrades, to get around the known issues... most use it as it is.

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:03 am 
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Location: Waterloo, ON, CA
My first thought is why would you want to import a UK unit that is running on the wrong voltage?

My second thought is why not buy Canadian and get a Squeaky Clean for less money?

Todd

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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 9:39 am 
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Joined: Wed Mar 28, 2012 3:37 pm
Posts: 125
Location: tonawanda, NY, US
Francis007 wrote:
Hello CAM users,

I'd like to "pick your brains" about this RCM. Supposedly, it's manufactured by the "Nitty Gritty" folks, but possibly not the newer units. Here's an image of it:

Image

And a link to a UK supplier:
Code:
http://snvinyl.co.uk/Record-Doctor-V-RCMRecord-Cleaning-Machine


I'd like to hear some opinions on this unit, how does it compare to the "fully automatic" RCM units, etc. On a side note, I can't find a dealer/distributor here in Canada. And, the US dealers/shops refuse to ship tne unit, outside the United States.

What do you guys think about, running a 230V/50Hz unit, here on our 120V/60Hz supply. I realize the motor would run "a bit faster", but it's probably under a 1000 watts (the specs on the Pro-Ject VC-S RCM, show it has an 800 watt motor). Those UK guys, seem to frown on the idea of running the 230V unit in North America. Anyways, they don't seem too keen on "exporting" their UK spec unit to North America. Thanks, for reading and replying.

Regards,
Francis007
I bought the Record Doctor about 20 yrs ago. It works well with the Disc Doctors cleaning method. After about 15yrs the spindle broke and a couple years ago the MFD box warped and Started to leak. I taped it up and it works OK, but the lack of a spindle makes it tough to work. I bought The Sqeaky clean a couple years ago, and it works about as well as the Record DR and seems well made. I've used my Brother's VPI 16.5 and don't think it does any better job than the other 2, but I give a lot of credit to my sucess in record cleaning to The DISC DR's method.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:36 am 
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Location: Etobicoke, ON, CA
sorry to say but everything else is junk once you use the Loircraft or Kieth monk machine - its the method used not the total cost that is important


just awesome !!!


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 10:56 am 
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Location: Ardrosssan, AB, CA
I have the RD V RCM. It is pretty decent for the money.

I agree with TeoAudio Ken's comments about the brush, not so great. I mostly use a Tonar wetgoat and it works very well; also use a MoFi cleaner brush and while good, not as good as the wetgoat.

Here are a few criticisms on the RD V:

-It is slightly messy as you are inverting a wet record and some drips will occur.

-The platter is tiny and a bit wobbly for more intense brushing/scrubbing.

-The vacuum on mine has a weird "faint burnt rubber" smell while running. It also gets very hot after about 10 records so I limit my cleaning sessions. As with almost all vacuum based units it is LOUD.

With that said, for the money, it is a very nice little unit. If you want to spend more, of course you will get better performance but within the few hundred dollars budget, it is a winner.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 25, 2017 12:00 pm 
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Location: Toronto, ON, CA
How does the RD rate compared to the KAB EV-1, apart from the fact that you have to supply your own vacuum?

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 3:47 pm 
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I may have found a stellar replacement hand brush for this sort of RCM unit/device, and they can all be found at your given locale (unless you live on a desert island). I'll have to try it a few times. I'll report back. We'll soon see.....

I'm not just using a listening test of before and after, I'm doing a before and after look-see of the grooves with a 50-400x stereo biological microscope

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 4:56 pm 
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Location: Richmond Hill, ON, CA
Francis007 wrote:

I'd like to hear some opinions on this unit, how does it compare to the "fully automatic" RCM units, etc. On a side note, I can't find a dealer/distributor here in Canada. And, the US dealers/shops refuse to ship tne unit, outside the United States.

Regards,
Francis007


Did you try Needle Doctor? They carry the Record Doctor machine and they will ship most items to Canada.

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PostPosted: Thu Aug 10, 2017 7:39 pm 
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Teo Audio wrote:
I may have found a stellar replacement hand brush for this sort of RCM unit/device, and they can all be found at your given locale (unless you live on a desert island). I'll have to try it a few times. I'll report back. We'll soon see.....

I'm not just using a listening test of before and after, I'm doing a before and after look-see of the grooves with a 50-400x stereo biological microscope



The bristles are just slightly smaller than a mono groove, as that is the record I checked under the microscope, with the bristles in the grooves. (turge malpert, -'The Ronery Bull'..bought it at the sally ann for this visual test). the bristles are stiff enough, long enough and you can work them, due to the directionality and stiffness. Plus it will hold fluid so you can work the fluid around for a cleaning session of multiple records. The stiff bristles are softer than the vinyl, so no issue there, and they are directional for the perfect lay of paint, and the brush is designed to hold paint. Not bad for a $5 experiment. Need to do a few more records to see if I'm wasting my time or not.

Image

Since I've got the stereo microscope to do visual checks, I may run into one that has better suited bristles. I'll keep looking.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 6:24 am 
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Ken, I tried the paint pad also. Results were ok, not stellar in my opinion, but I didn't carry out extensive comparison tests nor observations under the microscope. One problem for me was some shedding of the bristles, though the vacuum took care of that.

As I mentioned before, the Tonar wetgoat is a great RCM brush. Have you tried one?


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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:33 am 
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Demerara wrote:
Ken, I tried the paint pad also. Results were ok, not stellar in my opinion, but I didn't carry out extensive comparison tests nor observations under the microscope. One problem for me was some shedding of the bristles, though the vacuum took care of that.

As I mentioned before, the Tonar wetgoat is a great RCM brush. Have you tried one?


I have not tried the goatbush. But I do know the distributor. Great guy.

The trick in this case, is to do it on the cheap. Personally I tend to buy the best, before it is released and pay full pop. (my ancient audio buying history). So I'm all for premium product that meets or exceeds acceptance standards.

I may find a brush from that realm of the paint end of things... that goes deeper into the grooves.

I was also thinking of a tip polishing technique.

For example, a high oscillation rate 'vibrating' sander with a 2000 grit sandpaper. Then put the end tip of the cheap brush on the sandpaper surface (wet or dry), and experiment to to sharpen the blunt 90 degree cut of the synthetic fibers. This may create a deep groove cleaner brush for the vaunted $5. It's a worthwhile experiment to investigate. Just a subtle tip grind will do the job. The fibers are stiff, so they will sit on the surface and gyrate about and possibly sharpen themselves. Makes sense on paper.

This is about making things functional...but as inexpensively as possible. Red Green kinda methods but duct tape can work in suitable scenarios. This RCM is supposed to work, but to do it...without spending more on it. If the brush works, then it is applicable anywhere.

I knew I'd probably be going down a road that others have walked down before, but I might be able to McGuyver it a bit...

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Last edited by Teo Audio on Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:41 am, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 7:34 am 
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Teo Audio wrote:
Teo Audio wrote:
I may have found a stellar replacement hand brush for this sort of RCM unit/device, and they can all be found at your given locale (unless you live on a desert island). I'll have to try it a few times. I'll report back. We'll soon see.....

Great find Ken!

Thanks for posting.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 8:58 am 
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Quote:
For example, a high oscillation rate 'vibrating' sander with a 2000 grit sandpaper. Then put the end tip of the cheap brush on the sandpaper surface (wet or dry), and experiment to to sharpen the blunt 90 degree cut of the synthetic fibers. This may create a deep groove cleaner brush for the vaunted $5. It's a worthwhile experiment to investigate. Just a subtle tip grind will do the job. The fibers are stiff, so they will sit on the surface and gyrate about and possibly sharpen themselves. Makes sense on paper.


the guess is that the tips may not sharpen, but fray. But, the fray may be useful, if they don't sharpen. Not likely, but we'll give it a shot. And keep looking for a cheap brush with finer bristles that are just as stiff.

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PostPosted: Fri Aug 11, 2017 1:40 pm 
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Even cheaper than a paint pad is The Fantastic Brush found in dollar stores for about $2. Highly directional and stiff fibres that appear equally fine to the paint pad or close to it. I had one rigged with a cassette motor from a dead blaster strapped to it. Drilled a machine screw through the plastic spindle pulley to upset the balance, causing a form of oscillation to aid scrubbing. Worked fairly well. The biggest problem was it soaked up too much solution. Probably shed some too, but as I was using an hydraulic cleaner at the time so the shedding was no problem.

If you're so inclined, have a look at the bristles under your scope, Ken. I'd be curious to know what you think. It's another avenue to explore, at least.

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