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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 12:57 pm 
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as posted previously -
magman888 wrote:
I use 2 of the Douk Phono preamps with my Gyrodec and Transcriptors. I have owned the Pro-ject (very disappointing) the Rega (marginally better) and the Douk betters both, the Proj-ject by some margin. I sold a Graham Slee Communicator and bought the Douks - not quite as good but close imho.
"triathleteman" Do not dismiss this preamp out of hand - especially if you have not heard it.
Attachment:
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Quadzilla, I take it you have extensive experience with this preamp to form such a strong opinion of it :?:


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 1:24 pm 
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I hope Douk doesn't turn out to be a Dookie LOL

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 1:31 pm 
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racecars wrote:
I hope Douk doesn't turn out to be a Dookie LOL


Aren't you clever. I do hope it doesn't sound like poop though...

magman888 wrote:
as posted previously -
magman888 wrote:
I use 2 of the Douk Phono preamps with my Gyrodec and Transcriptors. I have owned the Pro-ject (very disappointing) the Rega (marginally better) and the Douk betters both, the Proj-ject by some margin. I sold a Graham Slee Communicator and bought the Douks - not quite as good but close imho.
"triathleteman" Do not dismiss this preamp out of hand - especially if you have not heard it.
Attachment:
17795.jpg


Quadzilla, I take it you have extensive experience with this preamp to form such a strong opinion of it :?:


It's either this or a Pro-Ject for about $50 more (used) which hasn't exactly been met with glowing reviews.

If I had another $200 to play with do you really think I'd be buying something for $60?

This is for a $100 AVR on a system that is so far from audiophile it's laughable...


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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 1:48 pm 
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I'd think at that budget the noise floor will be something to be conscious of. Personally I'd stick with brand name, especially if you can try it. Most phono preamps will have a noticeable hum when music is silent at higher volumes, maybe 50%+. Shouldn't be an issue considering the SPL of music is way higher. I'd expect a brand like Pro-ject to be decent, who knows if Douk offers better value. My project tube box ds sounds great

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PostPosted: Wed Jul 12, 2017 7:40 pm 
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I bought a Douk little bear and while it might not be a high end phono stage I think it's well worth the price. I used it with a Mission 775/774/773. and found the volume control on my integrated has to set to 1-2 o'clock to achieve moderate levels. This is is not a fault of the phono stage, I believe even though the 773 is a high output moving coil it's output is much lower than most mm carts. I think considering the price the Doak is a bargain.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 11:29 am 
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It is a bargain & sounds terrific. If you've heard one, that is. It used to be an even better bargain, as the price has gone up a bit. Curious as to the impressions of the 'Little Bear' version. Could be the same circuit in a different housing...
:?:


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PostPosted: Wed Sep 06, 2017 5:36 pm 
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Old Rusty wrote:
It is a bargain & sounds terrific. If you've heard one, that is. It used to be an even better bargain, as the price has gone up a bit. Curious as to the impressions of the 'Little Bear' version. Could be the same circuit in a different housing...
:?:


Just got mine tonight and having put 2-3 hours or so on it I doubt I've broken anything in, but first impressions aren't bad. I've owned 2 AVRs with phono stages and one Rotel integrated so my experience isn't vast. It's also been since June since I used this table and I've changed other gear as well.

1) It seems to like older recordings better - I played 3 records back to back, and it liked the Miles Davis reissue on 180 gram better than the two newer, electronic releases (M83, Cut Copy - both on 180 gram)

2) Sound seems a little constricted - I'm not getting the soundstage or airiness I used to have

3) Midrange and lower volume seems to be the sweet spot so far - cranking it up usually rewards me when I'm playing CDs but the highs get a little harsh when the volume goes up

Casual reading on tubes leads me to believe that some burn in will be beneficial and if that doesn't do the trick I have some NOS matched Mullard tubes on the way from eBay.

Magman888, have you gotten yours / do you have any impressions?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 5:58 am 
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Teo Audio wrote:
the little bear (the all ss version) is mentioned by the designers..as being openly stolen from a Denon AVR unit from some 10-15 years back.

So douk stole the design from some denon engineers who used their denon lore and some specs and suggestions from some given op-amp tech manual RIAA implementation suggestions.

The little bear is intellectual property theft.

Just like a lot of of other items, ie, very likely the vast majority that is on that given store.

Each time you buy, it's one more sliver of a nail in the coffin of the people who actually create the circuits and designs that you are trying to get to.

Intellectual property theft is the biggest problem in all that comes out of china.

I'm not speaking for or against some given side of the issue, just mentioning ....that this is what you deal with (high odds of such happening) when you buy many an item of such nature, from such a location.


I think this is what a manufacturer risks when moving operations to China and is well aware of the ROI and risks on such a move. I don't think Denon is hurting because of this item.

Flip side, you won't catch me investing on audio from AliExpress - all my big purchases have been from 'legitimate' sources and brands...

I take it you don't have any listening impressions on the phono stage? :lol:

-- 07 Sep 2017 14:01 --

Quadzilla wrote:
Teo Audio wrote:
the little bear (the all ss version) is mentioned by the designers..as being openly stolen from a Denon AVR unit from some 10-15 years back.

So douk stole the design from some denon engineers who used their denon lore and some specs and suggestions from some given op-amp tech manual RIAA implementation suggestions.

The little bear is intellectual property theft.

Just like a lot of of other items, ie, very likely the vast majority that is on that given store.

Each time you buy, it's one more sliver of a nail in the coffin of the people who actually create the circuits and designs that you are trying to get to.

Intellectual property theft is the biggest problem in all that comes out of china.

I'm not speaking for or against some given side of the issue, just mentioning ....that this is what you deal with (high odds of such happening) when you buy many an item of such nature, from such a location.


Excellent point, and I thank you for posting it in plain English for us. I am underwhelmed that they would bother to copy the phono stage from a turn of the century mid-fi A/V receiver. It certainly doesn't seem like a very high bar to me, considering that they likely used the crappiest Chinese components they could find. Then again, what do you expect for thirty bucks. None of this matters though to people who are looking for the best they can buy for next to nothing.


Slightly amusing point - not a high bar at all.

Also, $60...still wondering if you've bothered at all to listen to one...

I think you're missing the mark - it seems a few people who have weighed in and purchased one of these are doing it for purely experimental / messing around / fun purposes...we all know $10 worth of Chinese components won't amount to a 'giant killing' piece of gear and I'm sure most (if not all) of us have listened to some high end gear and recognize what constitutes high end...


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:06 am 
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From a similar ad ...

"This is one HiFi PHONO preamp. Iam re-design it refer DENON-AVR-2310CI AV amplifier, (that's a old classic AV-amplifier,one day,i bought it from Flea Market, after i find the PHONO function is very good,so i keep it),using a better OP chip.JRC OP chip.and replace some normal electronic components to better one.add Power LED display function,Gold interface,with real GROUND connect point,and now.here is a Mini KIT created.i test it with my same old classic Pioneer Turntable,there is Very good music replay,sound restore to original.if you had a turntable already,now,it's time to Revisit the classic".

I am glad to see that he hand-picked a flea market receiver for his intellectual property theft.
It is good to know that he put some design thought into it ... "Hey look, a receiver!" :lol:

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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 6:23 am 
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Quadzilla wrote:
From a similar ad ...

"This is one HiFi PHONO preamp. Iam re-design it refer DENON-AVR-2310CI AV amplifier, (that's a old classic AV-amplifier,one day,i bought it from Flea Market, after i find the PHONO function is very good,so i keep it),using a better OP chip.JRC OP chip.and replace some normal electronic components to better one.add Power LED display function,Gold interface,with real GROUND connect point,and now.here is a Mini KIT created.i test it with my same old classic Pioneer Turntable,there is Very good music replay,sound restore to original.if you had a turntable already,now,it's time to Revisit the classic".

I am glad to see that he hand-picked a flea market receiver for his intellectual property theft.
It is good to know that he put some design thought into it ... "Hey look, a receiver!" :lol:


This is classic China - I work in manufacturing and this doesn't surprise me at all. The Denon isn't all that bad, but the whole thing is rather amusing.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:22 am 
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Quadzilla wrote:
Teo Audio wrote:
All it takes is a bit of your time and some minimal skills and a total of about $125...it will cut your journey time and costs in half.


You are getting verbose again. :mrgreen:

... However, most of the guys who buy these things would balk at the thought of paying $125 for just about anything. Let's be honest, you can buy a half-decent used phono preamp for $125. These guys are looking for the 'Holy Grail', straight out of the box ... or the bubble wrap China Post envelope ... with free shipping ... for forty bucks. You know as well as I do, that people can convince themselves ... and nobody likes to admit that they bought a piece of crap, even for forty bucks.


Did you actually read anything here or do you storm into threads with an agenda and a holier than thou attitude?

This is probably the second or third time you've missed the mark...

We know it's cheap. We know there's better out there (2 other members in this thread have said they have heard better and heard worse), and you can't even get the price / cost right despite having it being mentioned 2-3+ times in this thread.

You haven't even listened to an example of the stage we're discussing, and you can't seem to understand that this is a cheap, fun, experiment - I'm not plugging this into a fully built LP12 with monoblocks powering Wilson Audio Sophias and I'm sure the other members are only toying with modest setups.

Not to mention nobody here is claiming **** is solid gold or telling anyone to sell a Clearaudio, Graham Slee, or any other component of value in order to hear and experience the wondrous Douk from Aliexpress.

In addition, nobody is insulting the value of quality gear that you keep defending...this is a harmless thread that you keep spitting all over.

Can you just go away unless you want to contribute something of value?


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:32 am 
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Don't sweat it, just enjoy your phono-stage. The stock tubes are OK, but tube-rolling can tailor the sound more to your liking. And these tubes are cost-effective & come in many variants. Give it a whirl & don't let the negative attitudes here affect your enjoyment.


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:37 am 
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Old Rusty wrote:
Don't sweat it, just enjoy your phono-stage. The stock tubes are OK, but tube-rolling can tailor the sound more to your liking. And these tubes are cost-effective & come in many variants. Give it a whirl & don't let the negative attitudes here affect your enjoyment.


I'm looking forward to throwing some Mullard / RTC tubes once they come in - did you notice any break in at all?

I'm not losing any sleep here 8)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 9:47 am 
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Break-in doesn't take long with these wee tubes, I just plug 'em in & wait maybe an hour or so. I like the sound of the black-plate variants, American, Russian, Chinese, etc. they all have a distinctive sound that pleases the ear. I just keep rolling them for fun. And isn't that what this hobby is all about, enjoying the music & having fun with your gear?
8)


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PostPosted: Thu Sep 07, 2017 10:07 am 
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triathleteman wrote:
mikehar20 wrote:
Now that we seem to be seeing members using tube phono preamps,would there be any advantage in using my spare Yaqin tube buffer between my PRO-JECT phono preamp and integrated amp?



My existing tube phono preamp has an astronomically high output impedence at 600ohm, typically from what I understand that matching output impedence and input impedence is good. I ordered this little preamp to "hear" the difference that it makes having a closely matched input/output.

I would guess, that if you run a tube buffer between units you would want to make sure things are matched? Like the previous post said, why not give it a try.


You want the input impedance to be at least 10x larger than the output impedance.


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