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 Post subject: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:29 am 
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Location: scarborough, ON, CA
When buying tubes from a dealer, they offer to 'match' tubes at a surcharge.
How critical is matching and wouldn't new tubes have been tested to have a similar spec?


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:44 am 
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scarbpaul12 wrote:
When buying tubes from a dealer, they offer to 'match' tubes at a surcharge.
How critical is matching and wouldn't new tubes have been tested to have a similar spec?


Brand new tubes will vary greatly in their specs. The need to match is device and application specific; in some cases it's unnecessary, other times it's essential. You are best to check with the manufacturer to see what they say is required. The tube store has some good information on their site:

http://www.thetubestore.com/Resources/M ... e-Matching

http://www.thetubestore.com/Resources/M ... ns-Service


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:48 am 
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When it comes to small signal tubes matching can give you better channel balance, but is not usually necessary. It depends on the circuit whether audible or not.
It is usually better to match power tubes, at least matched per channel. This is most important if there is not individual bias or the tubes are cathode biased. If the tubes have individual bias, matching becomes less important, however for maximum power and performance matching is always better.
Tubes typically have a fairly broad measurement tolerance, so just because they are the same tube, they could be as much as 20% - 25% off from each other.

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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 5:57 am 
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Location: scarborough, ON, CA
Maybe I should have added, I'm looking to replace the tubes on my audible illusions modulus 3a with mm phono stage.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 6:05 am 
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scarbpaul12 wrote:
Maybe I should have added, I'm looking to replace the tubes on my audible illusions modulus 3a with mm phono stage.

There's dozens, maybe even hundreds of threads on tube selection for that preamp, as it's a legendary tube eater (also speaking from experience here). Your only safe choice for that unit is a Russian 6H23 tube (the Russian equivalent of 6922). Aside from the discussion about matched tubes (and matched triode sections) you need to buy super quiet tubes. I would recommend paying a little extra and buying tubes from Upscale Audio that have been tested and selected for noise and microphonics.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:34 am 
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electrafixion wrote:
There's dozens, maybe even hundreds of threads on tube selection for that preamp, as it's a legendary tube eater (also speaking from experience here). Your only safe choice for that unit is a Russian 6H23 tube (the Russian equivalent of 6922). Aside from the discussion about matched tubes (and matched triode sections) you need to buy super quiet tubes. I would recommend paying a little extra and buying tubes from Upscale Audio that have been tested and selected for noise and microphonics.

+1

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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 7:46 am 
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electrafixion wrote:
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Maybe I should have added, I'm looking to replace the tubes on my audible illusions modulus 3a with mm phono stage.

There's dozens, maybe even hundreds of threads on tube selection for that preamp, as it's a legendary tube eater (also speaking from experience here). Your only safe choice for that unit is a Russian 6H23 tube (the Russian equivalent of 6922). Aside from the discussion about matched tubes (and matched triode sections) you need to buy super quiet tubes. I would recommend paying a little extra and buying tubes from Upscale Audio that have been tested and selected for noise and microphonics.


I did the search thing and found some threads that answer the AI question, thanks.
I'm going to get them matched, because, 'hey, what's another $20 us.?' and I can tell anyone who happens to notice,'yes, you are correct, they are matched!'.
It looks as though upscale audio is currently out of stock.
Thanks again for your input guys.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 8:01 am 
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Location: Sherbrooke, QC, CA
scarbpaul12 wrote:
When buying tubes from a dealer, they offer to 'match' tubes at a surcharge.
How critical is matching and wouldn't new tubes have been tested to have a similar spec?



All depends who does the matching. Some applications require matching tubes. Get them matched and be done with it.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:06 am 
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scarbpaul12 wrote:
It looks as though upscale audio is currently out of stock.

Give them a call or send them an email. The Electro Harmonics 6922 is actually a 6H23...I think that's what they recommended for my Audible Illusions. I'm sure they'll have something suitable in stock, I believe they are the biggest Tube dealer there is.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:13 am 
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Location: Waterdown, ON, CA
PBB wrote:
scarbpaul12 wrote:
When buying tubes from a dealer, they offer to 'match' tubes at a surcharge.
How critical is matching and wouldn't new tubes have been tested to have a similar spec?



All depends who does the matching. Some applications require matching tubes. Get them matched and be done with it.


Paul. You can buy the Russian 6H23 eb at the Tubestore in Hamilton and they will match them for you.

You most certainly don't want to use any nos 6dj8's or ecc88's in the AI! :shock:

The 6h23 is a very good sounding tube however, you may want to consider using a 7dj8 or a PCC88.
The tube store has nos examples of the pcc88 from telefunken,philips and tungsram.

I much preferred the telefunken pc88 to the 6h23 in that preamp paricularly in the phono stage.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:25 am 
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Parts Connexion has the 6H23n-EB in stock. On sale as well.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 9:28 am 
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Neither Parts Connexion or the Tube Store tests for noise and microphonics. For a picky preamps and especially phono stages, you really should buy something that has been selected carefully to be quiet.


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 10:21 am 
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I ordered a set of 4 directly from Art at Audible Illusions.
Very happy with the results.
Prices in USD.
Arrived in Ottawa in less than a week.

From the site:
Modulus 3A, 3B
(4-6H23n-EV) Grade A $275.00
(Grade AA-Ultra Low Noise) $295.00

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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 10:38 am 
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Location: Calgary, AB, CA
scarbpaul12 wrote:
electrafixion wrote:
scarbpaul12 wrote:
Maybe I should have added, I'm looking to replace the tubes on my audible illusions modulus 3a with mm phono stage.

There's dozens, maybe even hundreds of threads on tube selection for that preamp, as it's a legendary tube eater (also speaking from experience here). Your only safe choice for that unit is a Russian 6H23 tube (the Russian equivalent of 6922). Aside from the discussion about matched tubes (and matched triode sections) you need to buy super quiet tubes. I would recommend paying a little extra and buying tubes from Upscale Audio that have been tested and selected for noise and microphonics.


I did the search thing and found some threads that answer the AI question, thanks.
I'm going to get them matched, because, 'hey, what's another $20 us.?' and I can tell anyone who happens to notice,'yes, you are correct, they are matched!'.
It looks as though upscale audio is currently out of stock.
Thanks again for your input guys.


If you want some more info on why matched tube pair is important, go to this site http://www.mcshanedesign.net/ also he can help you selecting the right tubes for your unit.
Good luck!


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 Post subject: Re: matched tubes
PostPosted: Tue Mar 28, 2017 11:47 am 
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Location: scarborough, ON, CA
djmuisik wrote:
I ordered a set of 4 directly from Art at Audible Illusions.
Very happy with the results.
Prices in USD.
Arrived in Ottawa in less than a week.

From the site:
Modulus 3A, 3B
(4-6H23n-EV) Grade A $275.00
(Grade AA-Ultra Low Noise) $295.00


That's a good price, did they match them and check for microphonics?


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