Canuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio ForumCanuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio Forum
It is currently Thu Oct 19, 2017 4:46 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Forum rules


Feedback for dealers regarding experience OUTSIDE of CAM must go in the Dealer Feedback Forum.



Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next
Author Message
PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 6:48 pm 
Offline

Joined: Fri Jan 11, 2013 10:26 am
Posts: 1
Location: Kanata, ON, CA
Hi, I need some advice on my situation as a 1st time buyer.

- seller post the ad on Saturday, and it claim there is no issue with the Monoblocks
- payment via PayPal made on Sunday.
- seller sent the Monoblocks on Monday.
- it arrived on Wednesday noon
- I immediately tested the Monoblocks and I found one of the Monoblock consume more power than specification. The power acquired is more than 50W and confirmed with manufacture in the same day.
- also notified the seller of the issue, and I asked to have full refund as he claim there is no issue, and I will pay for return shipping.
- however he said he didn't see there is a reason to return the product, and could pay for the repair cost. However there is no dealer in Canada.

Shouldn't that is a seller responsibility for the repair? If it repaired, I am happy to re-own it.

Please advice what I should do?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Thu Sep 26, 2013 9:19 pm 
Offline
Premium User
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 19, 2006 11:44 pm
Posts: 6084
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
kschung wrote:
If it repaired, I am happy to re-own it.

Please advice what I should do?


Since the seller seems willing to co-operate and pay the repair cost...get an estimate on what it will cost to repair...find out the shipping costs involved...and then ask the seller to reimburse whatever that totals up to....before you ship the amplifier to the manufacturer

If the seller then refuses file a complaint with PayPal.

8)

_________________
I Put A Spell On You!!!


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 3:51 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:43 am
Posts: 580
Location: Sarnia, ON, CA
kschung wrote:
- seller post the ad on Saturday, and it claim there is no issue with the Monoblocks...

- I immediately tested the Monoblocks and I found one of the Monoblock consume more power than specification. The power acquired is more than 50W and confirmed with manufacture in the same day.


How do you test an amp for power consumption? Is the problem you describe something that would be detected in a standard listening test, or do you need specialized equipment?

I'm curious because I recently bought a couple amps and have never heard of this test, and I'm also wondering if it's possible the buyer honestly wasn't aware of the issue.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:34 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 2469
Location: GTA, ON, CA
99.9% of people selling an amplifier would NOT know how much power their amplifier consumed; therefore, unless you can hear a difference in sound, the seller did not "intentionally" misrepresent the amplifier.

It could be a simple fix like a bias adjustment.

How did you measure power consumption?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:45 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:09 pm
Posts: 500
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Just my 2 cents.... I have had, over the years several repairs done on various types of equipment. In many cases, after getting the piece back and using it for a short period of time (but past the warranty) the piece would fail again. What would you do then???


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 4:48 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Jun 17, 2008 4:50 pm
Posts: 12106
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Take it to someone that could fix it.... merely replacing broken parts over and over again suggests that there is a design flaw -- or that the problem was never fixed eg. short due to stray piece of metal...

Second option, sell it immediately after repair.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:25 am 
Offline

Joined: Wed Mar 21, 2007 4:09 pm
Posts: 500
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
Thanks Eric, but my point was directed to kschung. What happens if you get the repair done and the seller pays for it but then it fails shortly after. I would want to return for refund. If the current through the units are vastly different at the plug, there must be something wrong and if the unit works, the problem will be hard to find. The repair shop may not get it right.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 5:50 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:49 am
Posts: 1625
Location: Fairport Beach (in Pickering), ON, CA
brf wrote:
....

How did you measure power consumption?



Sencore PM157 measures the current and wattage of your equipment under test. Maybe the OP has one - I do.

_________________
Tom

Collecting vintage tube Pilot (Pilotone) HiFi gear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:33 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Tue Dec 07, 2004 4:18 pm
Posts: 2469
Location: GTA, ON, CA
Tom_r wrote:
brf wrote:
....

How did you measure power consumption?



Sencore PM157 measures the current and wattage of your equipment under test. Maybe the OP has one - I do.


Thanks Tom_r, I have seen consumer based devices in which you plug the item into and it displays the power consumed and then converts it $ to derive the cost of operation.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:42 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Fri Mar 04, 2005 1:11 pm
Posts: 5365
Location: Courtice, ON, CA
brf wrote:
Tom_r wrote:
brf wrote:
....

How did you measure power consumption?



Sencore PM157 measures the current and wattage of your equipment under test. Maybe the OP has one - I do.


Thanks Tom_r, I have seen consumer based devices in which you plug the item into and it displays the power consumed and then converts it $ to derive the cost of operation.

Commercial panel meters are also available on flea bay for peanuts.

_________________
A listening test comparing components is valid only when you are able to instantaneously switch between components which have been properly level matched and whose identities are unknown to you.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 6:55 am 
Offline
User avatar

Joined: Wed Mar 11, 2009 8:43 am
Posts: 580
Location: Sarnia, ON, CA
brf wrote:
99.9% of people selling an amplifier would NOT know how much power their amplifier consumed; therefore, unless you can hear a difference in sound, the seller did not "intentionally" misrepresent the amplifier.


That was my thinking exactly. The test equipment may be cheap, but how many people own it or know how to use it.

If you are that fussy about the gear you buy, and have test equipment that is not used by the vast majority of sellers, shouldn't you be buying locally so you can inspect the gear in person? If you do decide to buy something that needs to be shipped, shouldn't you be asking a lot more questions before sending money?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:09 am 
Offline

Joined: Mon Apr 26, 2004 2:33 pm
Posts: 3090
Location: Toronto, ON, CA
I'd say the seller is within his rights to choose paying for any necessary repair.

Unless it's a truly unusual piece, it shouldn't be necessary to ship it back to the manufacturer.

I assume there are many competent techs in the Ottawa area who could assess and, if necessary, repair the amp(s). Then have the tech e-mail a copy of the itemized repair bill directly to the seller.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:22 am 
Offline

Joined: Sun Dec 28, 2008 7:49 am
Posts: 1625
Location: Fairport Beach (in Pickering), ON, CA
arossphoto wrote:
brf wrote:
99.9% of people selling an amplifier would NOT know how much power their amplifier consumed; therefore, unless you can hear a difference in sound, the seller did not "intentionally" misrepresent the amplifier.


That was my thinking exactly. The test equipment may be cheap, but how many people own it or know how to use it.

If you are that fussy about the gear you buy, and have test equipment that is not used by the vast majority of sellers, shouldn't you be buying locally so you can inspect the gear in person? If you do decide to buy something that needs to be shipped, shouldn't you be asking a lot more questions before sending money?


All true. I only have a pile of test gear as I muck around with vintage tube gear, but some of the test equipment is useful for modern gear too. Only problem is most consumers can't answer the pertinent questions, so the buyer won't find out until an item is received. So of course local sale is preferred, but that's not always possible.

Maybe I missed it, but did the OP mention what amps we are talking about?

_________________
Tom

Collecting vintage tube Pilot (Pilotone) HiFi gear.


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:28 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Apr 29, 2010 8:12 am
Posts: 267
Location: , BC, CA
What amps are we talking about?


Top
 Profile  
 
PostPosted: Fri Sep 27, 2013 7:34 am 
Offline
Dealer/Sponsor
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 28, 2006 5:40 am
Posts: 450
Location: Hamilton, ON, CA
More details are needed here before jumping to conclusions. What make and model of amps are we talking about here.

_________________
Dan Santoni
http://www.dtsaudioelectronics.com


Top
 Profile  
 
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic This topic is locked, you cannot edit posts or make further replies.  [ 17 posts ]  Go to page 1, 2  Next

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 14 guests


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group