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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 7:47 am 
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-- 16 Oct 2013 12:03 --

nedrudrelyt wrote:
lzp1 wrote:
nedrudrelyt wrote:
Musical Fidelity almost pulled their entire stock out of Canada as well about ten years ago when Kevro was the main distributor for MF products. Kevro was so bad as a distributor it almost cost Canadians MF products from that point forward.

Not the way Kevro tells the story.


For sure as there are always two sides. All I can say is I had to deal with Kevro directly on a couple of occasions and it was not pleasant. I actually had to speak with a MF UK rep to get some results and lawyers almost had to get involved. But in Kevro's defense (which I don't think is much) Musical Fidelity was making an absolute garbage line of products at the time in the KW series of products. The return rate on this equipment was off the chart so I could see where Kevro was coming on some issues as the issues were large with so many problems with the line. So there are always two sides to the stories agreed...it takes two to tango.

But that whole experience had sworn me off MF products for good which is a little too bad as they still make some pretty great sounding gear.



The KW line was not garbage product! It was excellent stuff. The only really problematical component was the TriVista SACD player, due to the notoriously horrible transport that Phillips stuck their customers with. Almost all of them failed and that is not MuFi's fault. The same bad transport also caused huge problems for Krell, EMM Labs, Audio Aero (probably more) and of course, their own Philips SACD player!
No doubt some manufacturers handled the matter better than others, but if there was already tension between a distributor and the manufacturer that would cause more problems for the consumer.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:05 am 
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^^^^

Respectfully AVguy...and I speak from experience not only having sold MF products but owning three pieces of the KW line. Firstly...The Trivista was not part of the KW series it was the series before the KW...which was much better built. I owned a Trivista SACD for close to 4 years and never really had issue with the transport mech...it was the tubes were always faultly and those Trivistors were supposed to last the life of the unit...no way. The SACD player sounded great..it was just that MF lacked the ability to repair them properly after they were discontinued regardless of warranty. So...enter Kevro and the 'replacement' KW SACD player they had MF UK send me in replacement of the Trivista...it was a refurb (that Kevro said was new in box) and I had confirmed that with my tech at the time. But the new versions of the KW SACD machines were junk too. As you said the transports were even worse in these units than the Trivistas and the LCD screen was pooched when I got it AND it would not read half the SACD's I fed into it...just junk for a unit of that supposed caliber. Then...my KW preamp went sour...not a tube issue but a build quality issue on the inside with poor solders and wiring. I waited 9 MONTHS for Kevro and MF to get their crap together fixing the unit (all the while waiting for the replacement SACD player as well) ah but to no avail...I had to have my tech repair it again when I got it back. AND at this particular time I was trying out the KW phono stage which sounded great...when it worked which wasn't often so it went back as well. So here I had three pieces of the KW line ALL not working. Close to $20,000 in products and I could even turn them on. In Kevro's defense they were in the process of moving away from MF (or getting punted) and the customer service I received from Kevro was beyond reproach. This was when I had to consult a lawyer and was referred to an outstanding UK MF rep that took care of the situation.


Suffice to say that was the end of my Kevro and MF experience...for good.

Don't get me wrong...the KW series was quite good sounding but they rushed the line to market. The NUvista...A308 and Trivista series were all very successful and for whatever reason the KW series suffered from massive quality issues. And believe me when I say I wasn't the only one returning product.


So while I loved the sound of the Trivista SACD it just wasn't reliable. And I have always maintained the outstanding build/sound quality of the MF A308 series. Having said that I haven't heard much of the new MF stuff but I have heard some good comments...I'm just not sure if MF's build quality is back up to par.


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:16 am 
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nedrudrelyt wrote:
^^^^

Respectfully AVguy...and I speak from experience not only having sold MF products but owning three pieces of the KW line. Firstly...The Trivista was not part of the KW series it was the series before the KW...which was much better built. I owned a Trivista SACD for close to 4 years and never really had issue with the transport mech...it was the tubes were always faultly and those Trivistors were supposed to last the life of the unit...no way. The SACD player sounded great..it was just that MF lacked the ability to repair them properly after they were discontinued regardless of warranty. So...enter Kevro and the 'replacement' KW SACD player they had MF UK send me in replacement of the Trivista...it was a refurb (that Kevro said was new in box) and I had confirmed that with my tech at the time. But the new versions of the KW SACD machines were junk too. As you said the transports were even worse in these units than the Trivistas and the LCD screen was pooched when I got it AND it would not read half the SACD's I fed into it...just junk for a unit of that supposed caliber. Then...my KW preamp went sour...not a tube issue but a build quality issue on the inside with poor solders and wiring. I waited 9 MONTHS for Kevro and MF to get their crap together fixing the unit (all the while waiting for the replacement SACD player as well) ah but to no avail...I had to have my tech repair it again when I got it back. AND at this particular time I was trying out the KW phono stage which sounded great...when it worked which wasn't often so it went back as well. So here I had three pieces of the KW line ALL not working. Close to $20,000 in products and I could even turn them on. In Kevro's defense they were in the process of moving away from MF (or getting punted) and the customer service I received from Kevro was beyond reproach. This was when I had to consult a lawyer and was referred to an outstanding UK MF rep that took care of the situation.


Suffice to say that was the end of my Kevro and MF experience...for good.

Don't get me wrong...the KW series was quite good sounding but they rushed the line to market. The NUvista...A308 and Trivista series were all very successful and for whatever reason the KW series suffered from massive quality issues. And believe me when I say I wasn't the only one returning product.


So while I loved the sound of the Trivista SACD it just wasn't reliable. And I have always maintained the outstanding build/sound quality of the MF A308 series. Having said that I haven't heard much of the new MF stuff but I have heard some good comments...I'm just not sure if MF's build quality is back up to par.


Thanks for the background info nedrudrelyt :shock:


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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:45 am 
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the first post felt pretty angst driven bridge burning... the letter from Paul felt like an expected diplomatic response...

Feels to me more like a question of is there such a distributer who would want to do everything needed to carry the line?

Is there not these same kind of issues between all or most American audio co's and their Canadian distributers?

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 16, 2013 9:54 am 
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A long term MF dealer in the ‘States told me that there was often quality control problems when the gear was built in England – according to the dealer after the production was moved to Thailand in 2002 build quality (formerly done by hand) has improved greatly and failure rates are hugely down.


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PostPosted: Sat Dec 07, 2013 11:48 am 
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If Parasound no longer sells in Canada, why not let Canadian customers buy direct from Parasound instead of having to order from the U.S. distributors. Would the savings be worth it? I assume the US distributors would have tantrums though.


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PostPosted: Tue May 06, 2014 5:34 pm 
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^^^

that seems like the way to do it...


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 6:20 am 
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lmw9266 wrote:
If Parasound no longer sells in Canada, why not let Canadian customers buy direct from Parasound instead of having to order from the U.S. distributors. Would the savings be worth it? I assume the US distributors would have tantrums though.


Because they are not CSA and Ontario Hydro approved, therefore not allowed.
U.S. distributors are not allowed to sell into Canada either, if someone up here ends up with a piece, it will not be covered by Parasound at all.

-- 07 May 2014 14:23 --

Also, as a side note. The U.S. distributor for Parasound is Parasound.

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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 6:46 am 
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why is csa "and" ontario hydro approval necessary? or csa is actually approved by ontario hydro in ontario?


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 7:17 am 
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had several pieces over the years let me tell you there is a lot better out there for less money not a big loss imo


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 8:00 am 
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wesworld1970... CSA certification is issued once a product passes a series of power consumption and fault tests. Among the tests, the idea is that the chassis will not shock the user, passes ground fault tests, fire test, etc.

On that subject, Pass Labs gear comes to mind as some with very high prices that didn't pass (pun!) CSA regulations, and the owner has also failed to pay his patent upkeep fees, resulting in them defaulting. I detect a possible trend there.

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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 8:14 am 
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i see, interesting. Thanks!

-- 07 May 2014 10:15 --

you legally need csa to sell in canada?


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 8:27 am 
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lmw9266 wrote:
If Parasound no longer sells in Canada, why not let Canadian customers buy direct from Parasound instead of having to order from the U.S. distributors. Would the savings be worth it? I assume the US distributors would have tantrums though.


... and the guarantee that these units wouldn't travel the underground railway back to the US is what exactly? If there's a buck to be made someone will make it :wink:


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 10:29 am 
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wesworld1970 wrote:
i see, interesting. Thanks!

-- 07 May 2014 10:15 --

you legally need csa to sell in canada?


Thats an excellent question, anyone have insight ? if I can recall comments I once read in UHF Magazine correctly, no CSA certification on some high end gear had to do with the fact CSA pratically destroy your product in their tests, so, to get CSA certification, it can very expensive for a small high end company to sacrifice a $15 K amp for instance.....?


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PostPosted: Wed May 07, 2014 3:04 pm 
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rednecknber wrote:
had several pieces over the years let me tell you there is a lot better out there for less money not a big loss imo

I'm curious what pieces of gear did you have? and do tell whats better for less?
I have 7 halos in my system 4 JC1's an A 21 and an A51 plus a JC2 have not had one single complaint with the way it sounds looks or quality.
I for one am disappointed they're no longer available here in Canada


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