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Cables with the greatest impact in your system
Analog Interconnect 20%  20%  [ 47 ]
Phono cable 10%  10%  [ 24 ]
Digital 3%  3%  [ 7 ]
Speaker 22%  22%  [ 51 ]
Power 19%  19%  [ 44 ]
None 26%  26%  [ 61 ]
Total votes : 234
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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 10:40 am 
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Romex on a dedicated breaker.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 11:28 am 
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sasquatch wrote:
Bumpy wrote:

Double D, it's a digital signal. You cannot lose bits.


Bumpy – digital transmission is performed in an analog form similar to a square wave. And just like an analog signal, it is also susceptive to being influenced. In the case of SPDIF which includes TOSLINK and AES/EBU, this signal must also carry the clocking information which despite the advances with relocking technology within newer DAC’s, this is still critical. A DAC will employ a PLL circuit (Phase Lock Loop) that will make an attempt at reclocking the information but is still reliant on a steady clock from the source. A cable can induce clocking errors to which a PLL circuit may not be able to recover.

Modern DAC’s in the form of Asynchronous USB and SPDIF cannot recover lost bits. The technology is impossible with SPDIF and not present with USB.


I'm shocked that a cable could be considered a source of jitter.[/quote]
I believe that the theory being put forth is that a poorly made or shielded cable might allow enough interference through that the digital signal could be corrupted and therefore cause issues with proper data transmission. I might be misinterpreting though.[/quote][/quote]

Yes, it is a known fact that poor design and constructed cables can cause jitter in the digital signal transmission. This is one of the reasons why reclocking units are out there for sale for the sole purpose of mitigating this digital signal issues. Case in point I have a jitter reduction and reclocking unit that I've enjoyed over the years, however, in its manual it says that you can use the cheap digital cable from the CD transport to the unit and then use the best digital cable that you can afford to connect the unit to the dac. I'm anal in this sense that if you really want to get rid of the issues why not use the same brand of the best cables that I can afford to connect them. I did and I couldn't be happier and not only that the whole digital system is quiet as a tomb which is devoid of hash noise. FWIW, I'm using the Mark Levinson SPDIF XLR digital cables for all of them, they might be a little expensive but they're worth it IMO.


Last edited by tube54 on Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:42 pm 
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Wind Chaser wrote:
Back in the early eighties it was obvious to me that speaker cables can make a very big difference in the end result of what comes out of your speakers. Shortly thereafter I discovered the same held true for interconnect cables. At that time I don’t recall the option to upgrade the cables in any of my tone arms. I had the Magnepan Unitrac One, an arm by Grace with the F9E, the Syrinx PU3, and a HR100S. Had I known of such an upgrade, I probably would have considered it. As for the so called audiophile power cord, I don’t recall them being being available until the mid 90’s or so.

I’ve tried a few power cords ranging in price from about a $100 to $2000. And while some of them sounded different to some extent, none of these differences amounted to what I would call an actual “improvement”. As far as I am concerned, the transportation of a “refined” musical signal from one component to another (including speakers) is one thing. The delivery of “raw, unrefined power” from the wall socket to a component quite another. Try as I might I cannot comprehend how or why a power cable of all things could possibly have any sonic merit. So my question is, what is the explanation or science behind audiophile power cords? Do they purify the power by acting as filter? Please explain.


I too would like some thoughts on this. Im thinking of dabbling in some power filtration as a first step, but am interested in the experience of others in this regard. Almost 20% of respondents felt pretty strongly about this category which is not insignificant.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 12:53 pm 
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Re power filtration, I got tremendous bang for the buck, more than ten years ago, by buying a used ultra-isolation transformer on eBay. I powered my digital transport and DAC from it. These devices are more expensive today, but still probably the best buy for the money for such an application.

Unfortunately treating an entire system with an iso transformer requires a very large one, and these are expensive and hard to place.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 1:06 pm 
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Argon66 wrote:
Wind Chaser wrote:
Back in the early eighties it was obvious to me that speaker cables can make a very big difference in the end result of what comes out of your speakers. Shortly thereafter I discovered the same held true for interconnect cables. At that time I don’t recall the option to upgrade the cables in any of my tone arms. I had the Magnepan Unitrac One, an arm by Grace with the F9E, the Syrinx PU3, and a HR100S. Had I known of such an upgrade, I probably would have considered it. As for the so called audiophile power cord, I don’t recall them being being available until the mid 90’s or so.

I’ve tried a few power cords ranging in price from about a $100 to $2000. And while some of them sounded different to some extent, none of these differences amounted to what I would call an actual “improvement”. As far as I am concerned, the transportation of a “refined” musical signal from one component to another (including speakers) is one thing. The delivery of “raw, unrefined power” from the wall socket to a component quite another. Try as I might I cannot comprehend how or why a power cable of all things could possibly have any sonic merit. So my question is, what is the explanation or science behind audiophile power cords? Do they purify the power by acting as filter? Please explain.


I too would like some thoughts on this. Im thinking of dabbling in some power filtration as a first step, but am interested in the experience of others in this regard. Almost 20% of respondents felt pretty strongly about this category which is not insignificant.
Wireworld power cables filter noise around the 60hz range due to the layout of the cable. The 2m ones work better than shorter lengths due to the signal going through more of it. This is one of the weird instances where a longer cable is better.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:09 pm 
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Toby wrote:
CAM Staff have had more than one internal discussion about cable threads. Invariably they — the cable threads, not the CAM Staff — went off the rails, causing extra work for the volunteers and resulting in locked threads, and sanctions for Forum users whose records might otherwise have been spotless.


There have been a number of occasions when a "new member"
has introduced a new forum bringing up the topic of cables for their amusement.
Then the person has sat back and watched the fireworks.
It would be interesting to read the physiological profile of a person who is entertained
by doing this.

So I propose that in order to introduce a new forum on cables,
a new member have at least 50 or 100 comments.

.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:39 pm 
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Uunderhill wrote:
Toby wrote:
CAM Staff have had more than one internal discussion about cable threads. Invariably they — the cable threads, not the CAM Staff — went off the rails, causing extra work for the volunteers and resulting in locked threads, and sanctions for Forum users whose records might otherwise have been spotless.


There have been a number of occasions when a "new member"
has introduced a new forum bringing up the topic of cables for their amusement.
Then the person has sat back and watched the fireworks.
It would be interesting to read the physiological profile of a person who is entertained
by doing this.

So I propose that in order to introduce a new forum on cables,
a new member have at least 50 or 100 comments.

.

Lol. So you are referring to me underhill?
If so...I may have not posted a lot in this particular forum but I assure you that I am not a novice, have a very nice system and am psychologically stable. My goodness!! How offensive. There is no need for personal attacks to get a point across... which we all know is the biggest issue in forums. As a senior member you know this. I think I can feel confident that the good people in this community will not share your sentiment about limiting new people in the community and the moderators will do a good job on our behalf.

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Last edited by Argon66 on Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:02 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 2:57 pm 
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Argon66 wrote:
Uunderhill wrote:
Toby wrote:
CAM Staff have had more than one internal discussion about cable threads. Invariably they — the cable threads, not the CAM Staff — went off the rails, causing extra work for the volunteers and resulting in locked threads, and sanctions for Forum users whose records might otherwise have been spotless.


There have been a number of occasions when a "new member"
has introduced a new forum bringing up the topic of cables for their amusement.
Then the person has sat back and watched the fireworks.
It would be interesting to read the physiological profile of a person who is entertained
by doing this.

So I propose that in order to introduce a new forum on cables,
a new member have at least 50 or 100 comments.

.

Lol. So you are referring to me underhill?
If so...I may have not posted a lot in this particular forum but I assure you that I am not a novice, have a very nice system and am psychologically stable. My goodness!! How offensive. There is no need for personal attack here. If anything you may have just singled yourself out to the real moderators for scrutiny. I would argue what these forums need less is a senior member that needlessly lashes out. I think I can feel confident that the good people in this community will not share your sentiment.


Please. don't escalate. Back it down, escalation is not the way to go.

thanks.......:)

(It takes a stronger and better person to deescalate than it does to escalate)

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:03 pm 
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Argon66 wrote:
Uunderhill wrote:
Toby wrote:
CAM Staff have had more than one internal discussion about cable threads. Invariably they — the cable threads, not the CAM Staff — went off the rails, causing extra work for the volunteers and resulting in locked threads, and sanctions for Forum users whose records might otherwise have been spotless.


There have been a number of occasions when a "new member"
has introduced a new forum bringing up the topic of cables for their amusement.
Then the person has sat back and watched the fireworks.
It would be interesting to read the physiological profile of a person who is entertained
by doing this.

So I propose that in order to introduce a new forum on cables,
a new member have at least 50 or 100 comments.

.

Lol. So you are referring to me underhill?
If so...I may have not posted a lot in this particular forum but I assure you that I am not a novice, have a very nice system and am psychologically stable. My goodness!! How offensive. There is no need for personal attacks to get a point across... which we all know is the biggest issue in forums. As a senior member you know this. I think I can feel confident that the good people in this community will not share your sentiment about limiting new people in the community and the moderators will do a good job on our behalf.


Personally I thought your thread was legit. You did take the time to go back and modify the poll as per recommendations. Saying that, what Underhill claims is quite common. If your intent was not to spark a heated debate then don’t take offence.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:08 pm 
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Adriankn wrote:
Forbes_2 wrote:
From my experience, I find that power cords are underrated, and speaker cables are overrated.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk


Agreed 100%. Especially on digital equipment. I believe in going back to front with it. Although would usually be most fussy with ICs, the bulk of the business is behind the system when I'm setting something up.

YMMV and all that.

+ On digital systems,IME,the impact of PCs is often inversely proportional to the composite amount of mechanical noise present in the system.
…ergo- The full impact of filtering PCs on DACs & CDPs in attenuating EMI/RFI (when present on the line) can be masked by lower frequency mechanical noise that may exist in your system.
….IME,often the reason that differences in PCs are not detectable by some folks is….you can’t hear it through low frequency mechanical haze.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 3:26 pm 
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Yup. You are correct. I edited my response to soften it but did not post it fast enough. Lol.
All good.

-- 13 Dec 2017 23:39 --

I oversee many departments at work and mediate all day. Don’t need more sparks in my down time lol.
I’ve been upgrading my system for years and have reached my sweet spot of about 5k per component but my speakers were considerably more. So now it’s tweak and cable time...I have some symposium stuff, and have started to upgrade cables.

I read a lot! Many posts just focus however on interconnects, or power cables, or speaker wire... or deal with brand specific posts.

Thought it would be insightful for me and possibly others to see a poll including all options of where the community felt they got maximum benefit.

That’s it in a nutshell.

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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 5:49 pm 
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sthomas1049 wrote:
Voodoo Funk wrote:
Phono cable. 8)


Agree and should be included in the poll. World difference between analog interconnect used between 2 line levels compared to one used for phono



Any suggestions from you folks ? (Vpi prime scout) for a phono cable to my moon phono preamp . Theres a set of kimber kable hero's going from the moon pre to the line level preamp , cheapo rca's from moon phono pre to the vpi ?
Any suggestions would be a welcome !


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 6:24 pm 
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deuce07 wrote:
sthomas1049 wrote:
Voodoo Funk wrote:
Phono cable. 8)


Agree and should be included in the poll. World difference between analog interconnect used between 2 line levels compared to one used for phono



Any suggestions from you folks ? (Vpi prime scout) for a phono cable to my moon phono preamp . Theres a set of kimber kable hero's going from the moon pre to the line level preamp , cheapo rca's from moon phono pre to the vpi ?
Any suggestions would be a welcome !


deuce I sent you a PM.


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PostPosted: Wed Dec 13, 2017 8:03 pm 
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There is a new mission statement at the top of this page, and all pages in the Cables & Accessories Forum.

Please read it. In a nutshell, it deprives cable skeptics of the privilege of posting in any thread which is not a debate thread.

Moderators will be seeking to ban repeat offenders from this Forum.


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PostPosted: Thu Dec 14, 2017 3:54 am 
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Argon66 wrote:
Uunderhill wrote:
Toby wrote:
CAM Staff have had more than one internal discussion about cable threads. Invariably they — the cable threads, not the CAM Staff — went off the rails, causing extra work for the volunteers and resulting in locked threads, and sanctions for Forum users whose records might otherwise have been spotless.


There have been a number of occasions when a "new member"
has introduced a new forum bringing up the topic of cables for their amusement.
Then the person has sat back and watched the fireworks.
It would be interesting to read the physiological profile of a person who is entertained
by doing this.

So I propose that in order to introduce a new forum on cables,
a new member have at least 50 or 100 comments.

Lol. So you are referring to me underhill?


Not if your intent was legitimate.
We have had a number of "new members" create a cable forum
with the intent of being amused by a heated debate.

Suggest you list your system - that way CAM members can give far more informed answers.
.
Some pieces of equipment - like a Mac Integrated - are quite insensitive to cables.
Where other pieces of equipment are highly sensitive to cable changes.

If you have a digital front end - that's probably where you want to spend a fair bit of attention.
.
Also, does the Quality of Hydro affect the sonics of your system ?


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