Canuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio ForumCanuck Audio Mart Hifi and Audio Forum
It is currently Mon Dec 18, 2017 4:52 am

All times are UTC - 8 hours




Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 34 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3
Author Message
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 6:56 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 3:03 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Woodstock, ON, CA
Quote:
Volley Guy,

Now you've got me interested in getting my Kariks repaired.

As you know, the Karik and Numerik has 2 digital cables between them.
One is the sync lock and the other is digital information.

The original cables that Linn provided for both of these digital connections
were their analog interconnects - these were 1.2 meters long and became known as Linn Basic Black Interconnects.
Even though one of these cables was terminated with a BNC connector
it was still Linn analog cable.

However, these are digital signals and are designed for what is known as 75 ohm termination impedance.
If the cable and connector do not have a 75 ohm impedance, signal reflections will occur
and the digital signal will get messed up.

Replacing the original Linn "digital" cables with true 75 ohm digital cables
makes quite an improvement.

However, from your comment, it sounds like someone had already done this
this when you bought your used Karik / Numerik.

I just checked and it seems that LV-61s is digital cabling made by Canare
which is a true 75 ohm cable.


Thanks Underhill I had no idea Linn originally sold the pair with their brand IC's which makes sense as Linn always brands their stuff and the digital 75 ohm IC's are not theirs.

I was in Toronto at a high end store to meet the guy who installed high end gear for a living to buy the Karik/Numerik. He was clearly not just an installer but fanatic when he demoed the Karik Numerik at his house. He had his speakers shimmed precisely to the right level and spent a LOT of time on just the right cabling for the whole system and to be honest to this day one of the best sounding systems I have ever heard!!!


He sold it to me with two sets of those cables a longer and shorter pair. Not sure what the longer pair was for unless needed for distance between transport and DAC.

It was VERY interesting to see what a pro could do with modest amounts of money on his own system. It was AWESOME! He of course would have access to a lot of high quality used gear.

-- 07 Aug 2017 15:11 --

This may sound silly but I did not know the signal coming out digital is just one RCA say out of the Oppo and the sync cable on the Karik and Numerik is just to allow the two to talk?

The sync cable is not needed? At least as far as getting things going?

My expectations if I hooked the Oppo up is maybe a smoother sound but still terrible timing?

Listening to the Oppo after the Karik/Numerik is a BIG downgrade. So for sure not everything is better than old digital devices.

We have the Oppo connected to main system and my daughters drum teacher would have them listen to a song to follow the drums and only then did I realize just how bad the Oppo was! Just a mess!

It is good for watching movies but not suitable for music. To be honest I would not buy the Oppo with the expensive DAC again. Love the idea of the Swiss Army knife but in reality just does not cut it.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 7:54 am 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 3:03 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Woodstock, ON, CA
Uunderhill wrote:
Volley Guy,

a few other points,

If it is the spindle motor - quite a number of these motors were made by a massive company
called Mabuchi - a repair person can get the part number off the motor
and replace it - even if the motor is discontinued.


Yes it is a Mabuchi motor. I did have it apart and that part I could not find but that's just me!

Dan does not think it is the motor.

Things are moving past me. Simple laser repair and replace some caps was one thing.

There are many on this thread who do not want to even bother with CD and there obvious issues.

The whole thing confuses me. It seems you have choices of hardware issues with transports or software issues like you have talked about the computer music.

Linn dropped CD spinners and Naim and Rega still sell them. So even among companies there is no clear answer? I have noticed shockingly high prices for old high end spinners! They should be worthless but are not.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 9:13 am 
Offline
Moderator
User avatar

Joined: Tue Feb 22, 2005 2:06 pm
Posts: 4918
Location: Montreal, QC, CA
For everyone concerned -- manufacturers and listeners -- it's a question of time and money versus your satisfaction with the sound quality you have.

volleyguy1 wrote:
There are many on this thread who do not want to even bother with CD and there obvious issues.


For many people, the CD was never really good enough, even played on the best gear. Many technological advances -- oversampling and datastream reclocking for two examples -- were made just to address this problem. My own view is that the pleasure of listening to a great performance in 16/44.1 is real, but less than listening to the same performance (and master) in hi-res if it is available. So I am not content with limiting my digital source to 16/44.1, i.e. the CD. I want the possibility of hi-res playback, and a CD spinner won't give it to me.

Spinning SACDs might do what I want. But the spinner is a mechanical device which wears out, and parts run out and stop being produced. A computer playback system uses mass-market parts at minimal cost, and the digital files it plays can be moved easily to new media and playback systems if necessary. I decided not to invest in hi-res spinning media. Now, I have some competence in setting up and maintaining computer systems, which helped in deciding me to go that route.

Quote:
The whole thing confuses me. It seems you have choices of hardware issues with transports or software issues like you have talked about the computer music.


If I were starting out today I would probably go for an audiophile music server like a Bryston BDP. I can use my current library, there are no moving parts and the manufacturer is responsible for software. However if I already had a CD spinner I liked, I would continue to use it as long as it worked, and save my money.

Quote:
Linn dropped CD spinners and Naim and Rega still sell them. So even among companies there is no clear answer?


Naim and Rega did not make their own disc transport mechanisms. Linn had to stop making the optical equivalent of the LP12, once they realized that computer playback could beat even their best.

Quote:
I have noticed shockingly high prices for old high end spinners! They should be worthless but are not.


OK, in any era there are rare statement products, made to best practice with cost no object. New technology comes along and beats the old technology at a given price level, but statement products are just as rare in the new era. So the new tech beats the old tech, but cannot match the statement-level features unless it is priced so high that it won't sell in numbers. The older gear retains the value of its statement-level build features.

Not to forget that the sonics you know, and are familiar with, determine your vision of excellence, and your budget determines whether you can afford to have the latest. A move from an mp3 player to a well-built vintage spinner in good condition may open a world of music for you. And there are a lot of used CDs out there, selling as cheap as vinyl did in the 80s.


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
PostPosted: Mon Aug 07, 2017 4:11 pm 
Offline

Joined: Thu Aug 03, 2017 3:03 pm
Posts: 16
Location: Woodstock, ON, CA
Toby

No doubt hi-res would be better. I have some hi res but have to say CD level is better on Karik Numerik than hi res on the Oppo.

Now hi-res on a much better source would be better!

Interesting as you mention though Linn's CD12 often goes for $8k to just spin CD's.

A statement piece for sure! But pedestrian level Linn and other brand spinners still get a fair $.

Linn Karik Mimick Genki and Ikemi still go for big $. Linn preamps and amps not so much.

To me this indicates a market imbalance and shortage of quality sounding digital sources especially CD players. Manufactures might have moved past CD more than customers?

I find people in two camps some who think everything is better today than anything from the past with the thoughts of constant improvement and vintage lovers.

I was in camp 1 until I heard a Rega P3 smoke the top CD player 25 years ago and I own vintage tube amps after they smoked my newer Linn Kairn and Klout. :/

I get it from the company perspective if the Karik Numerik was $8k (20 years ago) and a new just as good player was $3k to the same manufacturer assuming both pieces lasted as long there would be a large drop in revenue assuming same customer base and it is now 20+ years later with less revenue...

So I want to not sell a $3k CD player just as good but a totally new "thing" for at least as much gross revenue as I got from the Karik/Numerik.

The companies have a vested interest in no deflation...


Top
 Profile  
Reply with quote  
Display posts from previous:  Sort by  
Post new topic Reply to topic  [ 34 posts ]  Go to page Previous  1, 2, 3

All times are UTC - 8 hours


Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest


You cannot post new topics in this forum
You cannot reply to topics in this forum
You cannot edit your posts in this forum
You cannot delete your posts in this forum
You cannot post attachments in this forum

Search for:
Jump to:  
Powered by phpBB® Forum Software © phpBB Group