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PostPosted: Sat Jan 21, 2017 5:47 am 
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>>Just swapped my Marantz SR78005 for Sony STR-ZA3000ES and figured I'll post a few impressions. Two things that impressed me - on the Maranz corrected sound wasn't that great for music - had to use direct or pure direct modes. With the Sony corrected sound is great with music - exceptional stereo imaging and very neutral sound.<< , by 'durack' http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1734737-sony-str-za3000es-quick-impressions.html

>>Finally the manager got involved and asked me to do a blind audition compared to the Anthem and NAD and I agreed and the third receiver was by far, not by a little but by far, the best sounding receiver for music and for theater. I care about music the most. I said, ok, what is it? He said "It's a Sony!" I started laughing but it was true. It was Sony's new Sony ES unit. It is fully 4K future proof with HDCP 2.2 built right in so that worked out well with my 4K TV at home. The model is Sony STR-ZA3000ES. It offers HALF the features of their $500 receiver and they are asking a grand more for it. On the ES models, they are like NAD, less is better. The price for the Sony ES was $1699 but after research and shopping I got a brand new one for $775. Also, the Sony ES comes with a 5 year warranty which beats NAD and Anthem.<< , by 'tedhontz' http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1521982-receiver-opinions-nad-t758-anthem-mrx-310-510-a.html

>>This is the ONLY Sony model that I can pick from because Sony only puts pre outs for an external amp on their ES line only and ONLY on the TOP model ES brand so that isn't cool at all.<< , by 'tedhontz' http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1734737-sony-str-za3000es-quick-impressions.html

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SONY-STR-ZA3000ES-ES-7-2ch-4K-AV-Network-Home-Theatre-Receiver-Warranty-/322335884408

http://www.lespac.com/verdun/electronique-audio/sony-str-da5400es-elevated-standard-home-theater-receiver_40945437D0.jsa
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-electronique/ville-de-montreal/sony-str-da5400es-elevated-standard-home-theater-receiver/1233002090


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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 3:26 am 
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>>The fait wanted, that I had the oportunity to listen to Pioneer LX71, Yamaha V3900 and Yamaha Z7, while Pioneer LX81 and Onkyo 906 were not available at KT-Radio dealer. KEF speakers were used in the test, which is the closest to my B&Ws. The front was iQ50 and the rest of the setup something that matches from KEF, but can not remember the exact model numbers. We tested the surround functionality with Blu Ray movies and CDs for stereo sound.

We first tested Pioneer, and now comes the ballad so, because I was not impressed about the Pioneer sound. The sound was flat / thin and lacked depth. Surround effects as such was good enough, but I was especially disappointed with the bass, which sounded stuffy at best or outright woolly at worst. Particularly bad was it when you put the receiver on the 'pure direct' while it worked a little better in conventional stereo.

While we waited for Yamaha we discussed if it was the speakers there was something wrong with. Were they simply too poor for such a test? But when Yamaha came in the KEF speakers suddenly kicked arse! There was suddenly more deeper low frequencies and better control especially the bass.

Yamaha Z7 had a significant boost in stereo with even greater depth than Yamaha V3900, and the speakers sounds for the first time makes sense, even when we pushed the volume up loud (although it is not so important how high they can play for my case, but it shows something about checking). No doubt that Yamaha Z7 is the winner here. It was simply a whole new experience! Complex sound patterns (like explosions) at the other receiver competitors appeared as a diffuse mass, but was suddenly much better defined and directional on Yamaha. We discovered nuances and details we did not hear from the other receiver competitors. In short, better controlled and subtle surround.

I certainly do not doubt that Yamaha is the right choice among the two for me. Now I am so excited about how Yamaha Z7 perform against Denon 4308 and possibly Sony STR-DA5400ES.

When it comes to HT movies we all agree that Yamaha is the king. There was just a little more of the cinema feeling when using Yamaha. That does not mean the other competitors are bad. It was a very close race between the three, and I would say Denon came in as number two. This surprised us a little that it was so close to when we tested Yamaha Z7 against Yamaha RX-V3900 and Pioneer LX71 in the store the Yamaha Z7 came out as a very clear winner. Maybe my room (4m x 4m) is not optimal for surround sound, or the competition is just harder with Denon and Sony.

In terms of music it very much depends on personal taste and what type of music you prefer. For classical music, we agreed Denon surpassed the others. It is slightly brighter sound than Sony, and a lot lighter than the Yamaha which came out last in this test. Denon has a fantastic treble and perform really well in the midrange. For bass-heavy R & B numbers the situation is reversed. These B&Ws has proved more than difficult to control in the bass, which must be exceptionally heavy! With Denon and Sony, it was at least a bit muddy in the deep bass end. Denon fared a little better than Sony, while Yamaha was clearly in a better class. Rock shared waters. Some preferred Denon, other Sony while I still preferred the Yamaha, which I generally found was a really good match for my B&W speakers. It was no great surprise, as several have already recommended me to look for Yamaha for B&W speakers.<<
, by 'Kratz', translatet review from http://www.hifi4all.dk/forum/forum_posts.asp?TID=75576

>>The Yamaha RX-Z7 sounds wonderful for a receiver as does the Marantz SR8002, which is now out of date. If I were to choose a receiver, it would be the Z7 because of it's attractive price and real-to-life power it delivers.<< , by 'ttowntony' https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/which-brand-of-reciever-produces-the-best-audio

>>I think both the NAD and Rotel are better, but only when it comes to stereo reproduction. The Yamaha Z7 will give you better performance with movies and very reasonable musical abilities as well as all the "bells and whistles". I think the Yamaha Z7 would be my choice, even if the NAD or the Rotel sounded better in stereo. The SQ improvement will be marginal and not worth forgoing all the benefits of the Z7 for.<< , by 'dante01' https://www.avforums.com/threads/rotel-rsx-1550-vs-nad-t775-vs-yamaha-dsp-z7-vs-onkyo-tx-nr906.1130203/

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/232196204876?clk_rvr_id=1157137911107&rmvSB=true

>>I did some shopping today and was thinking of an Anthem MRX 500 and adding an MCA 30 for the 3 front channels. I heard a demo of the Anthem automatic room processing (ARC) and was very impressed.<< , by 'Screen Shot' http://www.avsforum.com/forum/90-receivers-amps-processors/1340634-what-flagship-avr.html


Last edited by ELOS on Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:32 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 4:22 am 
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>>Yes, Rotel AVRs are highly musical. I did a side by side comparison last year with Marantz. While I love Marantz products and have a Blu-ray and a CD player (2 pcs) and did have an SR5600 AVR, I found the Rotel RSX-1057 to be more musical.<< , by 'pdn' https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/which-brand-of-reciever-produces-the-best-audio

>>Before I bought my Rotel 1065 , I did an A/B comparison between the Yamaha rxv2300 & Rotel 1055 , the Rotel was a clear winner in the 2 channel stereo mode ( which is more important to me than HT) , having said that , I find my Rotel 1065 awsome in HT.<< , https://www.hometheaterforum.com/community/threads/rotel-rsx-1065-vs-denon-yamaha-etc.115212/

>>I purchased the Rotel 1065 over the 1055 for the fact that the 1065 unit has got more powerful oomph than the 1055. Sure on paper its "only" got 25 watts/channel more , but the transformer in the 1065 is huge and I wanted a receiver with amps that can tolerate sustained torture , ie , loud listening levels and fluctating speaker impedance.<< , by 'Steve Bracks' https://www.hometheaterforum.com/community/threads/rotel-rsx-1065-vs-denon-yamaha-etc.115212/

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-stereo-systems-home-theatre/ouest-de-lile-qc/rotel-rsx-1065/1228507612?null ---> http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=42158&start=45 , http://img.canuckaudiomart.com/uploads/large/763137-rotel_rsx_1065_for_sale.jpg , http://obrazki.elektroda.pl/4012553700_1335825404.jpg , http://product-images.highwire.com/10784953/5112-8.jpg


>>Why spend the money on a Rotel RSX 1065 when you can get the RSX 1055 & an RMB 1075 AMP for almost the same cash?<< , by 'Rich Wenzel' https://www.hometheaterforum.com/community/threads/rotel-rsx-1065-vs-denon-yamaha-etc.115212/

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/122321039119?clk_rvr_id=1157163815455&rmvSB=true , http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649322896-rotel-rsx1055-surround-sound-receiver/ ---> http://www.iavscanada.com/wordpress/wp-content/uploads/Innovative-Audio-Rotel-RSX-1055-back-left.jpg
http://www.kijiji.ca/v-stereo-systems-home-theatre/st-johns/rotel-rmb-1075/1222356047 ---> http://www.laaudiofile.com/images/rmb1075b.jpg

http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649326500-rotel-rmp1075-120w-x-5-amplifier-amp-rsp1066-51-preprocessor/ ---> https://www.fein-hifi.de/images/product_images/original_images/2337_5.jpg , http://www.comoficho.com/oc-content/uploads/1070.jpg , http://www.hifishock.org/galleries/electronics/rotel/power-amplifier/surround-sound/rmb-1075-4-rotel.jpg


Or, you may be better off getting a nice two channel integrated amp, and later purchase a old used AV receiver with pre-out to hook to the integrated amp

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/322399550220?clk_rvr_id=1157605689478&rmvSB=true ---> http://www.audioreview.com/cat/amplification/amplifiers/acurus/dia-100/prd_116263_1583crx.aspx

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-electronics/kitchener-waterloo/nad-375bee-integrated-amplifer/1229594680 ---> https://www.audiotrends.com.au/sldigital/shop/images/gallery_455.jpg , instruction for hooking AVR to two channel amp ---> http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=41665&start=15

http://www.highperformancestereo.com/integrated-amplifiers/sim-audio-250i.html ---> http://www.hifishock.org/galleries/electronics/moon-by-simaudio/integrated-amplifier/250i-1b-moon-simaudio.jpg

>>In the same price range as the 2 amps you mention, there is the Rega Elex R and the Naim 5si. They are easily as good or better. They are worth a demo if possible. I own the Naim, my brother owns the Rega. We both briefly owned a NAD 375BEE before that. The Naim and Rega are far superior in musicality compared to the NAD.<<, by 'Scudder' http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=41512&start=0

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-stereo-systems-home-theatre/hamilton/rega-brio-r-amplifier/1226455437

http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649306780-primare-i21/ ---> http://www.martinloganowners.com/forum/attachment.php?attachmentid=15270&stc=1&d=1331323967

http://www.canuckaudiomart.com/details/649325765-rega-elexr/ ---> http://www.whathifi.com/rega/elex-r/review

>>I used to have Primare I30 and just only for 1 month after my dealer let me to home demo Naim System. if you want details go for Primare I30 (not by much) and if you want musicality...Naim...period!<< , by 'RIDZWAN' http://forums.naimaudio.com/topic/naim-vs-primare

Naim two channel amps are famous for their *Energegic toe tapping drive*

http://www.kijiji.ca/v-stereo-systems-home-theatre/ottawa/naim-nait-5si-excellent-condition/1228751238 ---> http://www.whathifi.com/naim/nait-5si/review

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Last edited by ELOS on Mon Jan 23, 2017 6:40 am, edited 15 times in total.

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PostPosted: Sun Jan 22, 2017 8:11 am 
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I can't comment on Anthem or the newer Yamaha receivers but in general it is a very bad idea to use an AVR for double duty.
They work well for movies and sometimes they sound ok with concert Blu-rays. When used as an audio only amp, they are seriously lacking in most meaningful aspects. Your far better off to get a nice little integrated for audio use.
Convergence seems to be a popular buzz word but it's not always practical or desirable. It's possible to set up an audio system and a H/T system even in a small room.
I also wouldn't discount soundbars. They've come along away and the best of them really enhance TV listening.
I know I've beating this horse to death but something that any prospective AVR purchaser should consider is reliability. AVR's screw up-a lot!
I have an Onkyo Integra that is little more than an ornament. It's had the HDMI board replaced several times. Once it took almost six months and I had to fight like hell to get it back.
My Marantz NR 1403 is on it's second HDMI board, a top of the line Denon couldn't be fixed and Denon washed their hands of it. Warranty be damned.
Caveat Emptor.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 10:13 pm 
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shoeshine wrote:
Hello,

I’m looking to buy a new home theatre receiver, which would get used about 50/50 time as surround and as a two channel system. I’m trying to get a sense on how much of a difference I will see between something like a the lower end of an NAD (like a T748) or something by Anthem or Emotiva versus big named brands that I could buy for a little cheaper (Denon, Pioneer, Onkyo) and direct some of the savings towards speakers. I’m looking to spend not much more than $1000 on the receiver, could always spend less! Could maybe be convinced to spend a little more. Would ideally buy new, but could also buy used.

......

I don’t actually have speakers selected for this yet. Ha! which maybe is the wrong way to go about it. But I’m trying to figure out a receiver budget so i can determine how much is left for speakers. It will be mini-monitors/bookshelves. no stand mounts. Something like Paradigm or NHT.



Hi Shoeshine, yes, you are correct, you are going about this the wrong way.
You should consider the order of importance of each component in your audio system chain. I feel that putting together a quality system is not unlike cooking a fine meal. You may use the finest ingrediants, however if over cooked, or over-spiced, it'll be a meal your dog might not touch.
So first things first, the most important part is your source of information, being the speakers, next is the system's source of information, such as CD player, Turntable cartridge etc.., last is the amplification system which will drive the speakers and match them tonally with the system.
The majority of your total investment should be on speakers. 60%
When you find a speaker's tonal quality that pleases you, and you can listen to it for a long time without fatigue, you might then have a better feeling of how some amplifiers can affect that speakers tonal quality in different ways, many high end amplifiers can magnify flaws in the system and vice versa with speakers and interconnects(the salt and pepper).
How about some British bookshelf speakers with Bi-Amp capabilities, and a Marantz or Cambridge Audio to drive them?
hmm, suddenly I feel peckish. :wink:

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